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Professional Cycling => 2017 Race Archives => Race Archives => Road Races => Tour de France 2017 => Topic started by: just some guy on June 27, 2017, 15:20

Title: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: just some guy on June 27, 2017, 15:20
(http://www.duesseldorfer-altstadt.com/inhalt/uploads/2016/01/10247266_1002510149787698_1435656278803594646_n-620x400.jpg)

Sporting aspects
The route

Running from Saturday July 1st to Sunday July 23rd 2017, the 104th Tour de France will be made up of 21 stages and will cover a total distance of 3,540 kilometres.
- 9 flat stages
- 5 hilly stages
- 5 mountain stages including altitude finishes (La Planche des Belles Filles, Peyragudes, Izoard)
- 2 individual time-trials stages
- 2 rest days
The 2017 Tour de France will include a total of 23 mountains climbs or hills and altitude finishes ranked in second, first or HC class.

A nd so begins the 104th La Grande Boucle, the race because of design every second will count, looking through the race the stages to win or lose time are few and fare between, to make back time there on papaer are even fewer opportunities, unless it rains and the winds pick up then it could be an amazing race  :D

Stage 1 will be about seconds gained and lost, the 14 km flat course will be a power ITT for the first #yellow

Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km, #tt


Of the 13 kilometres of the inaugural time-trial course, close to 10 will be set on the banks of the Rhine river or the bridges above it… and bends can be counted on the fingers of both hands! There will be no or almost no mystery: the “rouleurs” will have their word to say. In this speciality where a new generation is showing up, a multiple world-champion boosted by the support of his fans could well be the fastest man

(http://www.letour.fr/PHOTOS/TDF/2017/100/CARTE.jpg)

(http://www.letour.fr/PHOTOS/TDF/2017/100/PROFIL.png)

JSGs riders to watch


(http://www.procyclingstats.com/uploads/uploads00008/thumbs/Tony_Martin_2017.jpg)
Might just be long enough for the panzerwagon to take the win


(http://www.procyclingstats.com/uploads/uploads00009/thumbs/Stefan_Kung_2017_250.jpg) Küng will be let loose with all afterburners fired to get the #bmc car as high up in the caravan as possible, plus a stage win and leaders jeresy will be a nice bonus

(http://www.procyclingstats.com/uploads/uploads00008/thumbs/Primoz_Roglic_2017.jpg) Could be one of the riders to watch the whole tour, has a real chance of a sneaky top 5 GC and a podium on stage 1

(http://www.procyclingstats.com/uploads/uploads00008/thumbs/Jonathan_Castroviejo_2017.jpg) Similar to Küng in that a high place really helps the team, will be there or there abouts

(http://www.procyclingstats.com/uploads/uploads00008/thumbs/Richie_Porte_2017.jpg) The big question is can Little Richard win the whole show, he will be looking to be on the front foot here and Stage 3



 


Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Leadbelly on June 27, 2017, 16:06
I'd add Van Emden to that list.

Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km, #tt

Of the 13(?) kilometres of the inaugural time-trial course, close to 10 will be set on the banks of the Rhine river or the bridges above it… and bends can be counted on the fingers of both hands!

Prudhomme must be losing the plot. :P

It's 14km not 13km, and does he suffer from polydactylism as I see twelve bends.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: just some guy on June 27, 2017, 16:13
I'd add Van Emden to that list.

Prudhomme must be losing the plot. :P

It's 14km not 13km, and does he suffer from polydactylism as I see twelve bends.

He was next on my list but as the prediction game has 5 decided to stop there
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: latino on June 28, 2017, 12:39
I put Roglic as one of the breakthroughs for this Tour, and I think he'll show his strength right on first stage.
Might even take the win.

Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: DJW on June 28, 2017, 14:15
Don't see Porte being that high up Stage 1. Conventional wisdom is to treat #yellow like the plague until week 2 these days and he certainly doesn't need any extra pressure to crack.

It's an odd length, Martin, Castro and Roglic will definitely be up there.


My wildcard guess would be a sprinter - Matthews, GVA or Sagan
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: AG on June 28, 2017, 14:25
I think its too long for a sprinter.

Porte has been flying in TT's this year ... but I still think Martin will take it.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: M Gee on June 28, 2017, 15:25
I'd add Van Emden to that list.

Prudhomme must be losing the plot. :P

It's 14km not 13km, and does he suffer from polydactylism as I see twelve bends.
Meh, two of those you count are so gradual you almost can't count them. This is going to go to a TT man. Which one? I haven't the faintest. I've still got that Donald Duck icon somebody gave me once - I'll bet that icon that this goes to a known TT specialist.[1] Could be Martin, could be Phinney (but I don't think Phinney is going to take it). Who else is a TT spec?
 1. Make sure you let me know beforehand if you are going to take me up on this! I'm not gonna argue about it after the fact!  :)
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Leadbelly on June 28, 2017, 19:51
It was this one, right?

(http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/998/942/3c1.png)
 
:D
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: t-72 on June 28, 2017, 21:12
I think I will be cheering for the flying Slovenian! 
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: just some guy on June 29, 2017, 07:37
(http://www.letour.fr/PHOTOS/TDF/2017/100/meteo.gif)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DDd-APFXoAAz2NC.jpg:large)

typical  :D
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: stereojet on June 29, 2017, 08:52
Weather forecast is for heavy rain showers IIRC. Should make it a complete lottery, and hopefully decent television (and it'll doubtless mess up loads of fantasy predictions)
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: M Gee on June 29, 2017, 19:06
Weather forecast is for heavy rain showers IIRC. Should make it a complete lottery, and hopefully decent television (and it'll doubtless mess up loads of fantasy predictions)

Oh, yeah! Wet roads / dry roads / drying roads could completely turn results upside down!

Even wet wet wetter could change results.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: M Gee on June 29, 2017, 19:09
It was this one, right?

(http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/998/942/3c1.png)
 
:D
Yup - that's the one!  I won't concede, but this rain forecast certainly changes my confidence level!
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: just some guy on June 30, 2017, 10:44
Looks like the weather report is clearing up after 13.00 cet
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: M Gee on June 30, 2017, 15:42
Looks like the weather report is clearing up after 13.00 cet
That's not what googling 'weather dusseldorf july 1' tells me - but the probability of rain drops below 50% somewhere in the afternoon hours.

I would rather it rained the whole time, than rained and dryed. The one good thing is that if it rains hard in the morning, the road grease should be cleared off.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: latino on June 30, 2017, 16:46
That's not what googling 'weather dusseldorf july 1' tells me - but the probability of rain drops below 50% somewhere in the afternoon hours.

I would rather it rained the whole time, than rained and dryed. The one good thing is that if it rains hard in the morning, the road grease should be cleared off.

I agree, better to rain all through the stage or just rain hard to clean the roads and clear up before the start.
If the weather dries out during the stage, we could see vastly different times between the first riders and the last ones.

Luckily it's a prologue and the favorites are going to be the last ones on the road.
So the weather won't have a major impact on the GC.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Mellow Velo on July 01, 2017, 08:15
 Today's start times:-

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tour-de-france-stage-1-time-trial-start-times/
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: search on July 01, 2017, 08:22
and for those who like them printable...

~pdf Horaire de départ de l'étape 1 (http://velorooms.com/Themes/default/wowslider/data1/images/pdf/01_TDF_Heure_Depart_CLM.pdf)
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: t-72 on July 01, 2017, 12:08
Don't care so much about printing, but I need it to be in french or german to get in the zone  :D
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: t-72 on July 01, 2017, 12:11
Question: as weather is expected to influence the outcome, is there a rain-radar-tracker website for this region? (World Championship tip: we have a good one in Bergen  :D )
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: search on July 01, 2017, 12:16
from Dan Martin's blog in the Irish Times today. He said he worked a lot on his time trialing lately:

Quote
"Unfortunately we had a bit of a mechanical issue in the [Dauphiné] time trial, something which it cost me a lot of time. I can’t go into details about what happened, because of the sponsors [of the equipment in question], but I lost a lot of time that I wouldn’t otherwise have. One plus for the Tour is that it means that people will still underestimate me in the time trial. But I am very happy with the progress I have made. The legs were good there and afterwards, I seem to have got even better. I have never felt better going into the Tour de France.”

let's see how it goes :cool
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Capt_Cavman on July 01, 2017, 13:27
Oops I got my Martins confused. Who's going to underestimate Tony Martin in a time trial? I wondered. Then I wondered what difference it woud make if anyone did. is Froome going to soft pedal because he thinks the panzerwagen is off colour? Then I realised it was Dan talking but I'm not sure it changes anything.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: everway9 on July 01, 2017, 17:38
Hi everyone.

I'm new here so a big HELLO to you all. :)


I'm watching the first stage ITT and was surprised to see an individual time trial as the first stage. I saw that Valverde crashed and then heard that a few other big names decided not to start the stage.


I'm wondering how this affects the overall GC. With those not starting stage 1 or crashing out of the stage does that mean that their Tour is over or is there some sort of safeguard which means that they will be able to continue and if so what will the time differences be?

Thanks in advance. :)
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: LukasCPH on July 01, 2017, 19:23
First of all, welcome to VR! :welcome

I'm watching the first stage ITT and was surprised to see an individual time trial as the first stage. I saw that Valverde crashed and then heard that a few other big names decided not to start the stage.

I'm wondering how this affects the overall GC. With those not starting stage 1 or crashing out of the stage does that mean that their Tour is over or is there some sort of safeguard which means that they will be able to continue and if so what will the time differences be?
Since this was a regular ITT and not a prologue (<8 km), those who didn't finish the stage (Valverde & Izagirre) are out of the Tour. Not that they'd be able to ride on with their injuries.

I'm not sure what you mean by "a few other big names decided not to start the stage". Of course there are some star riders who chose not to ride the Tour (or weren't selected by their teams) - and they logically didn't start the stage.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: M Gee on July 01, 2017, 19:24
Well, there we go. Done and dusted. Weather awful or awfuller. Too many chutes. Quintana is going to miss Valverde - he has done a lot more good for Nairo in GTs than most ppl credit him.

For Sky, I don't think there could be a better result. Sky doesn't have to work to protect yellow until stage 5, and they can choose NOT to defend then. GT will most likely remain in yellow until then, although there is a minor chance he will lose it at Longwy (stage 3). And Sky won't care then, either. So Froome and Sky mates are well placed, and ALL the challengers are on the back foot on day 1. Not a good start for those who want to beat Froome. Sagan has a better start for yellow than all the GC challengers chasing Froome. I won't be surprised if Sagan takes Longwy, and gets yellow for a couple of days.

If anybody had taken me up on the icon bet, I would be switching to Donald sniffing glue. But, nobody took it up! I think I'll see if I can get a better photo of one of my regular beasts to use anyway.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Carlo Algatrensig on July 01, 2017, 19:47
As much as I'm pleased for Thomas today has made me realise that I don't like Grand Tours opening with this sort of length TT. Either have a road stage or a prologue of about 6km. Time gaps would be smaller and so chances of the jersey swapping because of time bonuses is more likely. I think for the jersey to swap before stage 5 either Matthews or Sagan will have to win all 3 stage between now and then and I can't see that happening.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: ansimi on July 01, 2017, 20:44
Has anybody seen what Izagirre's status is? I can't find anything. His team seems to have terrible communications too.

I hate slippery TTs:(
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: killswitch on July 01, 2017, 20:55
Has anybody seen what Izagirre's status is? I can't find anything. His team seems to have terrible communications too.

I hate slippery TTs:(
UAE and Bahrain got no coverage at all. I wonder if it has to do with politics?
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: everway9 on July 01, 2017, 20:57
Hi LukasCPH and thanks for your reply :)

I'm sorry I was just listening to the commentators on Eurosport and heard that a few big names hadn't even started the stage. It came after Valverde had crashed out and I thought that they were meaning that due to the dangerous conditions some riders had not started the stage. I now realise that they meant that some big names were not competing in the tour altogether. LOL... that will teach me to not to start watching the stage so late in the day.

I was very confused about my post. When I got the email notifying me someone had replied to my post I clicked on the link in the email to view the reply which was: http://velorooms.com/index.php?topic=8599.new;topicseen#new    I got Error 404 Sorry, but the requested page does not exist.

I then went to my profile page and clicked on 'My Posts' and discovered that the title had changed from 'Stage 1 and GC' to 'Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km'

It appears as though someone has moved my post, disregarded my post title and moved the text elsewhere.

I would have been ok with that except no one told me they were moving it and did not provide a link for me. Hummmmm ???   :D
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Mellow Velo on July 01, 2017, 21:08
 TT tyres being blamed for a lot of the crashes.
The Jumbo trio were using them as was Nicholas Roche.
You would think that Jumbo would have cottoned on, if not after the first, but the second.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: t-72 on July 01, 2017, 21:09
UAE and Bahrain got no coverage at all. I wonder if it has to do with politics?

Not entirely true, #bahrain Sonny Colbrelli was in focus early on. Later I think the producers simply lost it - clocks not working, winner didn't get more than a finish line shot on TV, etc.
One of the worst TV productions from ASO I have seen, and worse than RCS' time trial productions this year.

They're also worse on safety, using a lot of the inverted Y shape or inverted T shape barriers with a protruding foot and pretty little cushioning at difficult corners. (One exception today).
ASO also have some L- shaped barriers and tend to prioritize them for sprint sections etc - but RCS is using them a lot more. They are simply safer for the racers as they don't hit the protruding foot as easy.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: ansimi on July 01, 2017, 21:31
UAE and Bahrain got no coverage at all. I wonder if it has to do with politics?

I expect a team like this to have better PR! I can never cheer for that team but I want to know Izagirre is OK and they don't seem to be saying anything? They may not have been able to get camera coverage today but they can update their own media.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Armchair Cyclist on July 01, 2017, 22:15
TT tyres being blamed for a lot of the crashes.
The Jumbo trio were using them as was Nicholas Roche.
You would think that Jumbo would have cottoned on, if not after the first, but the second.

I don't cycle seriously enough to have ever used them or need to know about them, but if TT tyres are glued on, as referred to during the commentary (ITV4), can they be changed rapidly?
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Mellow Velo on July 01, 2017, 22:43
I don't cycle seriously enough to have ever used them or need to know about them, but if TT tyres are glued on, as referred to during the commentary (ITV4), can they be changed rapidly?


Since some Jumbo riders didn't use them, I thought they'd change to a different wheel.

Anyhow, Pat Bevin on Valverde corner.....

https://twitter.com/AshConing/status/881247743720796160
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: t-72 on July 01, 2017, 23:06
Quote
All our riders started and went quite well with solid performance; however, our leader Ion Izagirre who started as the last of our team, crashed badly in the corner close to the point where Alejandro Valverde (Movistar) had crashed as well. It was a very hard hit into the fence. Izagirre was then immediately transported to the hospital by an ambulance in company with the team doctor Luca Pollastri. The first diagnosis said that Ion Izagirre has an unstable lumbar fracture and he needs a surgical treatment. We will come with further information in the next days.
We are deeply sad that Ion will not continue this year’s Tour de France, where he was meant to be the team leader after the strong performance this season. It is a big loss for Team Bahrain-Merida.

Source: Bahrain-Merida homepage (http://teambahrainmerida.com/sad-start-of-tour-de-france-for-tbm/)

EDIT: Seeing how many riders went down and how hard they went down on that corner, could ASO have foreseen that this was a highly risky point along the route and added some padding on those fences, maybe used L-fences instead of inverted Y fences and in general, made sure that the most difficult point on the route was a bit less dangerous?
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: ansimi on July 01, 2017, 23:25
Ouch:( I wonder if Izagirre and Valverde get to stay in the same hospital? Izagirre probably can't be transported for a while with that injury but I'm sure they have fantastic care in Düsseldorf.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: M Gee on July 02, 2017, 01:06
. . .

EDIT: Seeing how many riders went down and how hard they went down on that corner, could ASO have foreseen that this was a highly risky point along the route and added some padding on those fences, maybe used L-fences instead of inverted Y fences and in general, made sure that the most difficult point on the route was a bit less dangerous?

I wouldn't think they could have foreseen it - because it seems to me the whole of the danger of that corner was created by the rain conditions. On a fair day, that corner would have been fast. I would not think it possible to predict WHICH corner, of 9, would present the danger on a day like today. On the other hand, they could have taken those safety measures on every one of those 9 corners. Its not like they aren't making money on this.

TT tyres being blamed for a lot of the crashes.
The Jumbo trio were using them as was Nicholas Roche.
You would think that Jumbo would have cottoned on, if not after the first, but the second.

Sh*t, I'd want the grippiest tires I could get on a day like this one.


 . . .Anyhow, Pat Bevin on Valverde corner.....

https://twitter.com/AshConing/status/881247743720796160

MV, that looks to me like it was not the same corner - as the barrier banners are different than what I saw when Valverde went down - of course it could just be a bit farther on . . .
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: search on July 02, 2017, 09:55
from Dan Martin's blog in the Irish Times today. He said he worked a lot on his time trialing lately:

let's see how it goes :cool

well, he did alright only in the 2nd part...

Split Times:

RANK NAME INT INT -> FIN FIN
1      #sky   THOMAS Geraint      09:23 (5.)      <- 06:41:48 (1.) ->      16:04:48
2      #bmc   *KÜNG Stefan      09:20 (3.)      <- 06:50:07 (3.) ->      16:10:07
3      #sky   KIRYIENKA Vasil      09:20 (4.)      <- 06:52:25 (7.) ->      16:12:25
4      #katusha   MARTIN Tony      09:19 (1.)      <- 06:53:28 (9.) ->      16:12:28
5      #quickstep   TRENTIN Matteo      09:24 (7.)      <- 06:50:26 (4.) ->      16:14:26
6      #sky   FROOME Christopher      09:28 (12.)      <- 06:49:15 (2.) ->      16:17:15
7      #jumbo   VAN EMDEN Jos      09:28 (14.)      <- 06:52:08 (6.) ->      16:20:08
8      #sky   KWIATKOWSKI Michal      09:20 (2.)      <- 07:00:11 (28.) ->      16:20:11
9      #quickstep   KITTEL Marcel      09:26 (9.)      <- 06:54:56 (10.) ->      16:20:56
10      #dimension   BOASSON HAGEN Edvald      09:28 (15.)      <- 06:53:19 (8.) ->      16:21:19
11      #sunweb   ARNDT Nikias      09:31 (19.)      <- 06:50:35 (5.) ->      16:21:35
12      #cannondale   PHINNEY Taylor      09:23 (6.)      <- 06:58:36 (20.) ->      16:21:36
13      #astana   GRIVKO Andrey      09:27 (11.)      <- 06:54:56 (11.) ->      16:21:56
14      #orica   IMPEY Daryl      09:28 (13.)      <- 06:55:43 (13.) ->      16:23:43
15      #movistar   CASTROVIEJO Jonathan      09:25 (8.)      <- 07:00:08 (26.) ->      16:25:08
16      #sunweb   MATTHEWS Michael      09:29 (16.)      <- 06:56:37 (15.) ->      16:25:37
17      #ag2r   *LATOUR Pierre      09:31 (20.)      <- 06:58:25 (19.) ->      16:29:25
18      #bora   SAGAN Peter      09:31 (18.)      <- 06:59:20 (24.) ->      16:30:20
19      #movistar   AMADOR Andrey      09:27 (10.)      <- 07:04:42 (46.) ->      16:31:42
20      #astana   *LUTSENKO Alexey      09:30 (17.)      <- 07:04:00 (45.) ->      16:34:00
21      #quickstep   GILBERT Philippe      09:33 (21.)      <- 07:02:04 (34.) ->      16:35:04
22      #jumbo   GESINK Robert      09:36 (23.)      <- 06:59:08 (22.) ->      16:35:08
23      #bahrain   COLBRELLI Sonny      09:39 (31.)      <- 06:57:36 (16.) ->      16:36:36
24      #lotto   WELLENS Tim      09:39 (32.)      <- 06:58:37 (21.) ->      16:37:37
25      #bora   BODNAR Maciej      09:37 (26.)      <- 07:01:04 (31.) ->      16:38:04
26      #jumbo   *ROOSEN Timo      09:39 (33.)      <- 07:00:10 (27.) ->      16:39:10
27      #katusha   KRISTOFF Alexander      09:40 (37.)      <- 07:01:02 (29.) ->      16:41:02
28      #katusha   HOLLENSTEIN Reto      09:43 (47.)      <- 06:58:21 (18.) ->      16:41:21
29      #orica   *YATES Simon      09:40 (36.)      <- 07:01:42 (33.) ->      16:41:42
30      #trek   FELLINE Fabio      09:41 (39.)      <- 07:01:03 (30.) ->      16:42:03
                           
53      #movistar   QUINTANA Nairo      09:45 (58.)      <- 07:08:04 (57.) ->      16:53:04
54      #bora   MAJKA Rafal      09:46 (61.)      <- 07:07:40 (55.) ->      16:53:40
55      #cannondale   TALANSKY Andrew      09:43 (46.)      <- 07:11:09 (78.) ->      16:54:09
                           
57      #quickstep   MARTIN Daniel      09:52 (79.)      <- 07:02:22 (36.) ->      16:54:22
58      #trek   DEGENKOLB John      09:40 (38.)      <- 07:14:25 (95.) ->      16:54:25
                           
63      #ag2r   BARDET Romain      09:43 (44.)      <- 07:13:26 (92.) ->      16:56:26
                           
65      #jumbo   ROGLIC Primož      09:59 (123.)      <- 06:57:37 (17.) ->      16:56:37
66      #astana   ARU Fabio      09:44 (52.)      <- 07:13:01 (88.) ->      16:57:01
                           
68      #trek   CONTADOR Alberto      09:45 (54.)      <- 07:13:00 (86.) ->      16:58:00
69      #movistar   BETANCUR Carlos      09:47 (66.)      <- 07:11:24 (80.) ->      16:58:24
70      #astana   FUGLSANG Jakob      09:44 (50.)      <- 07:14:29 (96.) ->      16:58:29
                           
95      #cannondale   URAN Rigoberto      09:57 (107.)      <- 07:11:22 (79.) ->      17:08:22
                           
113      #uae   *MEINTJES Louis      09:53 (87.)      <- 07:23:48 (140.) ->      17:16:48
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Capt_Cavman on July 02, 2017, 10:06
Interesting split times. Froome followed Kwiat in the car and Kwiat  didn't get home (2nd then 28th). The diff between 1st and 20th on the first split was 12 seconds out of 9.5 mins but 17 seconds on the 2nd split out of 6.5 mins.

The key was pacing and knowing when to take care. Sky got it way more right than anyone else bar Kung.

I couldn't see little  Ritchie? Written off already?
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Joelsim on July 02, 2017, 10:24
Interesting split times. Froome followed Kwiat in the car and Kwiat  didn't get home (2nd then 28th). The diff between 1st and 20th on the first split was 12 seconds out of 9.5 mins but 17 seconds on the 2nd split out of 6.5 mins.

The key was pacing and knowing when to take care. Sky got it way more right than anyone else bar Kung.

I couldn't see little  Ritchie? Written off already?

Little Richie still has his 2 minute penalty/mechanical  to add, although we're not sure which stage it'll happen on.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: t-72 on July 02, 2017, 10:51
I wouldn't think they could have foreseen it - because it seems to me the whole of the danger of that corner was created by the rain conditions. On a fair day, that corner would have been fast. I would not think it possible to predict WHICH corner, of 9, would present the danger on a day like today. On the other hand, they could have taken those safety measures on every one of those 9 corners. Its not like they aren't making money on this.

Sh*t, I'd want the grippiest tires I could get on a day like this one.


OK, there were some reports on twitter this morning which (if true...as yet they're a bit unconfirmed) paints a bleak picture of ASO's efforts when it comes to rider safety.



I come from a skiing background and I see plenty of lame excuses for poor safety work in pro cycling. Yes, riders have to accept that there is a risk when riding on the edge that will never go away. However, with relatively simple means they could have had far less falls and less serious injuries yesterday. It's not like it was the first time it rains in Düsseldorf, so it is a bit exaggerated to blame everything that happened on the weather.

12 turns in a race (at least a race of this economical magnitude) can easily and at fairly low cost be safe-guarded better than what we saw yesterday. It's pretty much routine in ski-racing.

Yesterday, they could have:

Stopping the race and cleaning up the corner could have had a huge impact on the serious incident statistics, if it is true that spilled fluids from a race motorcycle was a factor in most of the accidents. Also, stopping the race for evacuation of Izaguirre would have avoided the near-miss incident of Phinney. In an ITT these are real options as it is different from the "show most go on" road race where one rider fallen seldom has consequences that can be dealt with in a timely fashion to reduce risk for the rest of the riders. In an ITT the race organizers have choices to make.

EDIT: Norwegian TV2 confirms Movistar are blaming a race motorcycle accident. (http://www.tv2.no/sport/9223262/)
 
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: Mellow Velo on July 02, 2017, 11:09
Luke Durbridge's crash. Looked a bit concussed to me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnZXV6hbB68&sns=tw
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: t-72 on July 02, 2017, 11:19
That crash video shows how unfit that kind of barriers are for protecting cyclists. They're made for organizing crowds at concerts and similar occasions.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: LukasCPH on July 02, 2017, 15:10
tl;dr
Who cares? They're only pro cyclists. We'll find replacements for them, no problem. :shh

Yeah, that obviously isn't my opinion. It's a stance that would explain what happened (dangerous crashes) and didn't happen (better safety measures).


Mind you, some of the blame may have to be placed with the Düsseldorf organising committee instead of ASO. I would think that ASO 'outsourced' pretty much everything related to this Grand Départ, only supplying the peloton, timing, sponsor banners and the like.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: M Gee on July 02, 2017, 15:11
. . .

12 turns in a race (at least a race of this economical magnitude) can easily and at fairly low cost be safe-guarded better than what we saw yesterday. It's pretty much routine in ski-racing.
 . . .
 

T-72, excellent post, excellent argument. If I could like it twice, I would. You are absolutely right. And, if there WAS a moto downing, they could do like some of the auto race tracks do and scrub the corner. It is sounding more and more to me like we are at a juncture w/ cycling race safety like moto-racing went through some 20-30 years ago.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: LukasCPH on July 02, 2017, 16:19
What's more, today's finish in Liège had the L-shaped barriers all the way.

So, yeah, I think this is on the Düsseldorf organisers, not ASO.
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: search on July 02, 2017, 16:35
Mind you, some of the blame may have to be placed with the Düsseldorf organising committee instead of ASO. I would think that ASO 'outsourced' pretty much everything related to this Grand Départ, only supplying the peloton, timing, sponsor banners and the like.

in Yorkshire back then the barriers were brought from France. Actually everything was. So if they bring it over the channel, I'd think it would be the same for Germany
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: LukasCPH on July 02, 2017, 17:27
in Yorkshire back then the barriers were brought from France. Actually everything was. So if they bring it over the channel, I'd think it would be the same for Germany
You'd think so; and so would I.
But then, why did Liège have the 'better' barriers today? Unless the Belgians (cycling-experienced that they are) did that on their own accord ...
Title: Re: Stage: 1 - 1 July : Düsseldorf ITT, 14.00 km
Post by: t-72 on July 02, 2017, 21:42
You'd think so; and so would I.
But then, why did Liège have the 'better' barriers today? Unless the Belgians (cycling-experienced that they are) did that on their own accord ...

Barriers are probably rented and not owned by the race organizers although if anyone owns their own barriers it might be ASO. However, as they are (clearly not) sport-specific I would assume the companies that own them also rent them to other events like concerts, national day parades, marathons  and god-knows-what: the gay pride parade, maybe. It is a general purpose thing used for cycling not a cycling thing used for anything else. There is a lot of fences involved and moving them is a major logistics operation, as they need to be picked up and sat down one by one. This will be more work than moving the same weight of boxed cargo from a to b. How much fences? I don't know about the TdF, but the organizing committee for the 2017 world championship has just picked up 40 kilometers of fencing somewhere - that's a shipload!

I would guess it is hard to move fences to new destinations overnight and that large races like the Tour and the Giro probably have several sets of fences that they transport along not to the next finish location, but one they will be using later?  (ie...barriers don't travel  Düsseldorf --> Liege but maybe Düsseldorf --> Longwy?)