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just some guy

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Re: Operation Puerto
« Reply #300 on: June 25, 2015, 09:30 »
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  • Of course, if this turns out someday to be the industry standard integrated handlebar-computer-braking solution then I'll eat my kevlar-reinforced aerodynamic hat.

    Larri Nov 12, 2014

    Flo

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #301 on: June 25, 2015, 09:35 »
    Gotta love the Spanish :win
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    just some guy

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    carllewis

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #303 on: October 19, 2015, 19:32 »
    Hi all

    I am the author Carl Lewis, who has just written the book 'Spanish Sport: The Greatest Con or Jealous Rumour?'.  I started out writing the book with the title 'What is the greatest sporting con of all time?'  Once I research Operation Puerto I changed my mind.  Firstly I have read a lot of your blogs and would like to thank you all for your comments and thoughts.  I am not a conspiracy theorist but I have never seen such a cover up and it is a shame that cycling is getting the vast majority of the negative publicity.  I would like to point out that Guiardiola, an ex-Barcelona football failed two drugs tests shortly after leaving the club, The president of Real Sociedad stated publicly they doped between 2001 and 2007 and the UCI president Pat McQuaid was told by the Spanish authorities tennis and football players were involved.  At least Cycling has lived up to its demons and I feel is far cleaning now than it probably has ever been.
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  • Joelsim

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #304 on: December 04, 2015, 20:36 »
    Maybe the focus will be on AC and Valv.Piti again soon. And the rest.

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/operacion-puerto-appeals-sentence-due-for-january-2016/
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  • just some guy

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    stereojet

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #306 on: January 11, 2016, 11:25 »
    I'd be willing to bet that the appeals will fail, the blood bags destroyed and the cover up complete.
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #307 on: January 11, 2016, 11:28 »
    Think you will be correct
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  • cj2002

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #308 on: January 11, 2016, 11:42 »
    Think you will be correct

    6 months ago, I think you would have been correct. But recent events in Russia, and at the IAAF and FIFA HQs, mean that this decision is somewhat more loaded than it might have been before.

    Before all the IAAF/Russia doping stuff, Spain could have destroyed the samples and no-one - outside of that core of cycling fans and interested journalists - would have batted an eyelid. But now... now I think they will feel the eyes of far more people interested in their decision.

    That's not to say that I disagree with you both... but that the ramifications of them doing so would be further-reaching than before, so they might (just might) think twice.
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  • He shook his head sadly and told me that endemic drug use had compelled him to give up a promising career. "Even one small local race, prize was a salami, and I see doping!" - Tim Moore: Gironimo (Riding the Very Terrible 1914 Tour of Italy)

    just some guy

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #309 on: January 11, 2016, 11:49 »
    Good point well made CJ
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  • Capt_Cavman

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #310 on: January 11, 2016, 11:53 »
    I agree with CJ2002, I don't think they'll destroy them. But I don't think we'll see a list of names attached to them within the next decade.
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  • DB-Coop

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #311 on: January 11, 2016, 12:17 »
    Time to short sell stocks in Spanish football?
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #312 on: January 11, 2016, 12:41 »
    Very hard to believe there will be any real movement on this. At the most, they might flog some long-retired cyclists and a couple of fairly anonymous distance runners.

    Sensationalist clickbait tweet that will read like an anticlimax for cultural ostriches and, for the rest of us, act like a gentle wake-up alarm because we'd forgotten about the story for a few months.
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    stereojet

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #313 on: January 11, 2016, 13:01 »
    Good point CJ. I honestly hope that you're right but the cynic in me is feeling quite strong today!
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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #314 on: January 11, 2016, 13:05 »
    Not a chance. Real and Barca?

    If it does happen I will be absolutely astonished.

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  • AG

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #315 on: January 11, 2016, 13:26 »
    oh. For whatever reason I thought they had already destroyed the bags.

    I dont believe they will ever reveal the results even if they keep them.   Real and Barca too much money to let that happen
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  • stereojet

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #316 on: January 11, 2016, 16:50 »
    I thought it was the Madrid teams and the Spanish national football team that worked with Fuentes while Barcelona used del Moral? Or have I got that mixed up? Can't quite remember.
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #317 on: January 12, 2016, 09:41 »
    I thought it was the Madrid teams and the Spanish national football team that worked with Fuentes while Barcelona used del Moral? Or have I got that mixed up? Can't quite remember.

    Sounds right to my memory
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #318 on: January 12, 2016, 09:45 »
    I thought it was the Madrid teams and the Spanish national football team that worked with Fuentes while Barcelona used del Moral? Or have I got that mixed up? Can't quite remember.

    Sounds right to my memory

    Indeed. Fuentes was based in Madrid, Del Moral in Catalunya (near Valencia). Fuentes may also have been present with the Spanish team during the World Cup held in Germany (I forget the year) since he was alleged to have developed a German connection in his supply network.
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  • Jimmythecuckoo

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #319 on: January 12, 2016, 10:09 »
    Not a chance. Real and Barca?

    If it does happen I will be absolutely astonished.

    Agreed. It seems to have become an urban legend that Barca footballers and Spanish tennis players were doped up to the max, but if there is real proof and any sort of legal case, it will be miraculous.
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  • The fens are just West West Flanders really...

    LukasCPH

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #320 on: January 12, 2016, 10:29 »
    Fuentes may also have been present with the Spanish team during the World Cup held in Germany (I forget the year)
    2006.
    Would be surprising though as in June/July 2006, Fuentes was already under arrest and stuff, and his whole network was being trawled up.
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    L'arri

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #321 on: January 12, 2016, 11:41 »
    2006.
    Would be surprising though as in June/July 2006, Fuentes was already under arrest and stuff, and his whole network was being trawled up.

    Spot on, yes. Perhaps I've misremembered the details but the German connection was definitely there. Maybe he had proxies to do the job, à la Ferrari.
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  • Carlo Algatrensig

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #322 on: January 12, 2016, 13:03 »
    Even if the Blood bags aren't destroyed what are the chances of linking a bag to a specific person?
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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #323 on: January 12, 2016, 13:57 »
    Don't forget Fuentes has said he will potentially name people on his list after the outcome of this.

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  • L'arri

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #324 on: January 12, 2016, 15:25 »
    Even if the Blood bags aren't destroyed what are the chances of linking a bag to a specific person?

    Next to zero.

    1. There would need to be a reinstated investigation with a reset SoL.

    2. Fuentes would have to give not only names but concrete evidence of their activities.

    3. Individuals would need to be compelled to give samples.

    4. All of the above would need to be done without State or private interference.

    It just isn't going to happen, is it? :P
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  • Carlo Algatrensig

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #325 on: January 12, 2016, 15:28 »
    Next to zero.

    1. There would need to be a reinstated investigation with a reset SoL.

    2. Fuentes would have to give not only names but concrete evidence of their activities.

    3. Individuals would need to be compelled to give samples.

    4. All of the above would need to be done without State or private interference.

    It just isn't going to happen, is it? :P

    No.
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  • Flo

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #326 on: January 12, 2016, 15:34 »
    Next to zero.

    1. There would need to be a reinstated investigation with a reset SoL.

    2. Fuentes would have to give not only names but concrete evidence of their activities.

    3. Individuals would need to be compelled to give samples.

    4. All of the above would need to be done without State or private interference.

    It just isn't going to happen, is it? :P
    I may be imagining things but I thought CONI linked Valverde with Puerto based on DNA they got from a blood sample taken at a doping control? Surely the same could be done with other riders?
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #327 on: January 12, 2016, 15:41 »
    I may be imagining things but I thought CONI linked Valverde with Puerto based on DNA they got from a blood sample taken at a doping control? Surely the same could be done with other riders?

    That's absolutely true, Flol, yes and well remembered since you must still have been in diapers back then. :hug

    I was thinking more about the 'protected sports' than cycling but it is theoretically possible if the legal facility and the historical collection of DNA both still exist.

    In Valverde's case, he was totally targeted by CONI and that has contributed, I think, to his ridiculously sanctimonious attitude about the whole thing both then and now.
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  • cj2002

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #328 on: January 13, 2016, 09:15 »
    Just spotted this in a Guardian piece on the next installment of Dick Pound v. the IAAF.

    Quote
    An internal briefing in September 2012 for Lamine Diack, IAAF president at the time, estimated 42% of tested Russian elite athletes doped. Suspected doping in Turkey, Spain, Morocco and Ukraine also “is particularly worrying”, it said.

    This may mean nothing, of course. Alternatively, it may put pressure on the Madrid courts not to perpetuate a cover-up and risk Spain becoming the next Russia.
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  • 42x16ss

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    Re: Operation Puerto
    « Reply #329 on: January 13, 2016, 09:51 »
    Don't forget Fuentes has said he will potentially name people on his list after the outcome of this.
    The question is who? Will they be current, high profile athletes or retired, foreign nobodies? I strongly suspect that many of the blood bags will somehow happen to be "untestable". The rest will simply confirm what we knew (Valverde, Basso, Mancebo, Sevilla etc) and possibly some long retired smaller names in other sports but that will be about it.

    Fuentes offered to give his full client list on the stand in court - his reward was immediate removal from the courtroom. He's also received several death threats. Nothing ground breaking will come of this, everything that was permitted came out in 2006.
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