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Kiwirider

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Nys and Leinders ...
« on: December 24, 2012, 14:04 »
A kinda sad article - and not just because cutandpastecentral.com cyclingnews is too lazy too translate the googlish properly ...

Nys: Leinders is a "Very Honest Person"Cyclo-cross star personal friends with controversial Belgian doctor

Sven Nys said he was surprised by charges that former Rabobank team doctor Geert Leinders was involved in doping whilst at that team. “I know Geert as a very honest person, with whom I always worked correctly,” he said.

Leinders is said to have been named in Levi Leipheimer's affidavit in the USADA Lance Armstrong case, having sold the rider EPO and helping him use it.

Cyclo-crosser Nys rode for Rabobank from 1998 to 2008, and formed a friendship with Leinders .

“He was very important in my career. He used to write my training schedules and can give good psychologically analyze and motivate an athlete,” Nys told Het Nieuwsblad. “We still call each other occasionally."

“Geert knows me through and through. He is the man who counseled me not to stay still too long after a cyclocross season as I get older.  These are small details that ensured that I won't make mistakes. So now he is in the news, and that surprises me so very much. "


I just hope that this isn't a sign that doping isn't making more of an inroad to 'cross than appeared to be the case before now ...  :o
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  • froome19

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    Re: Nys and Leinders ...
    « Reply #1 on: December 24, 2012, 14:07 »
    To me I can not imagine that Nys would have been willing to come forward with this if there was anything dodgy underneath the surface..

    Still interesting that he is willing to risk his reputation for Leinders.. they really must be good friends :D
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    Dim

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    Re: Nys and Leinders ...
    « Reply #2 on: December 24, 2012, 15:58 »
    Do we have a link to the original source, can we get an accurate Dutch translation?

    its also critical the circumstances of the comments, was he collared post race and asked about Leinders and just gave a quick quote, was it part of an interview, or did he voluntarily come forward and make a statement.

    There are big question marks over Nys by those who dont follow cross that closely, wins everything, even looks like Gilbert in his national jersey, but cross is a different beast to the road, different effort, different kind of doping. But, if he voluntarily came out with this, hes put himself in a stupid situation.

    The old addage, sometmes its best to say nothing.

    Post Merge: December 24, 2012, 16:16
    To me I can not imagine that Nys would have been willing to come forward with this if there was anything dodgy underneath the surface..


    tempted to agree with this, unless its a double bluff.

    Besides, the cross boys have different suppliers to the road boys :D
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  • « Last Edit: December 24, 2012, 16:16 by Dim, Reason: Merged DoublePost »

    Dim

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    Re: Nys and Leinders ...
    « Reply #3 on: December 24, 2012, 16:19 »
    The original article
    http://www.nieuwsblad.be/sportwereld/cnt/DMF20121223_00412834

    Quote
    Sven Nys: ‘Ik ken Geert Leinders als een eerlijk man'
    Eén van de atleten die het dichtst bij de voormalige Belgische wielerarts van rabobank die nu onder vuur ligt, Geert Leinders, staat is Sven Nys. De veldrijder leerde hem kennen in zijn Rabo-periode (1998-2008) en hield er een persoonlijke vriend aan over.

    ‘Ja, ik ben verrast', zegt Nys. ‘Ik ken Geert als een heel eerlijk persoon, met wie ik altijd correct werkte. Hij was enorm belangrijk in mijn carrière. Hij schreef vroeger mijn trainingsschema's en kan een atleet psychologisch goed analyseren en motiveren. Wij bellen elkaar nog altijd af en toe. Geert kent mij ook door en door. Hij is de man die me raad geeft om na een veldritseizoen niet te lang stil te liggen als je ouder wordt. Dat zijn kleine details die ervoor gezorgd hebben dat ik nooit fouten heb gemaakt. Dat hij nu zo in het nieuws komt, verbaast me dus heel erg.'

    Google translate
    One of the athletes who are closest to the former Belgian cycling doctor rabobank now under fire, Geert Leinders, capable Sven Nys. The cyclo-cross rider met him in his Rabo-period (1998-2008) and was a personal friend to have. "Yes, I am surprised," said Nys. "I know Geert as a very honest person, with whom I always worked correctly. He was very important in my career. He used to write my training schedules and a good athlete psychologically analyze and motivate. We call each still occasionally. Geert knows me through and through. He is the man who gives me counsel after a cyclocross season not too long standstill as you age. These are small details that ensured that I would never have made mistakes. So that now he is in the news, surprises me so very much. "

    So basically CN have used google translate. Would be interesting to get a dutch perspective on it.
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  • Slow Rider

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    Re: Nys and Leinders ...
    « Reply #4 on: December 24, 2012, 16:36 »
    Not much more to it, judging from the article. Bad translation by CN, I'll give a quick better once since it's a short article anyway ;)

    Quote
    One of the riders who is closest to Geert Leinders, the Belgian former team doctor of Rabobank who recently came under fire, is Sven Nys. The cyclocross rider got to know him during his period in the Rabo team (1998-2008) and the two remained personal friends.

    'Yes, I am very surprised', Nys says. 'I know Geert as a very honest person, with whom I've always worked correctly. He was very important in my career. He used to write my training schedules, and he is able to psychologically analyse and motivate a person very well. We still call each other occasionally. Geert knows me through and through. He is the man who gave me the advice not to stop riding for too long after a cx season when I got older. Those are the little details that esured I never made any mistakes. The way he is in the news right now, surprises me very much.'

    Nothing much to it really, pretty basic article.
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Nys and Leinders ...
    « Reply #5 on: January 25, 2015, 15:35 »
    Nys: "Doctor Leinders spared me all that stuff"

    "Leinders always gave me fair and honest advice. There wasn't even talk of any grey zone. Everything between him and I was natural and healthy. That's why I'm so surprised about all those stories about blood doping. I never heard anything about that.

    "Could it be because we 'cross riders had a bit of a special status at Rabobank? Possibly. I did ride on the road a bit in Spring for three seasons but I never did any training camps with the team, never mind ride a Tour de France.

    "Crossers also had their own soigneurs and mechanics. Does that explain it? Or is it because I never asked [for doping]? After all, the responsibility also lies with the rider. If you never ask, you don't get any offers. If you don't go looking for something, you won't come across it so easily. I'm still convinced of that."

    http://sporza.be/cm/sporza/wielrennen/1.2217832 (NL)
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    Re: Nys and Leinders ...
    « Reply #6 on: January 25, 2015, 23:44 »
    actually in some ways I would kinda buy that.

    If you dont ask, they wont push it on you (unless you are trying to ride GT's).

    When you dont win, are desperate to retain a contract and facing having to go find a real job ... you will come back and ask
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Nys and Leinders ...
    « Reply #7 on: January 26, 2015, 07:49 »
    actually in some ways I would kinda buy that.

    If you dont ask, they wont push it on you (unless you are trying to ride GT's).

    When you dont win, are desperate to retain a contract and facing having to go find a real job ... you will come back and ask

    To provide a bit of context, which could both defend or condemn Nys depending on your pov, the quote above is actually from his own weekly column in that other GVA, i.e. the Gazet van Antwerpen rather than Greg Van Avermaet.

    Nys needn't even have mentioned Leinders in his column and he is, for most diehard Flemish cycling fans, a man who can do no wrong anyway. Perhaps he felt that talking about Leinders would head off later, inopportune questions, but although he is on record already (per OP), it was not entirely necessary to discuss it.

    Otherwise, it is worth noting that CX had plenty of its own issues. I did not record them because my work concerns road cycling but on the rare occasions that Belgium has unearthed a cottage industry of doping, the CXers were usually there or thereabouts too. In the early 2000s, as Nys' own career stepped into high gear, EPO was rife in Belgian CX and the suppliers were the same as for road riders.

    Indeed it may not be a coincidence that, at that time, there were also greater demands on CX riders to do a Spring on the road following their CX obligations. This reflected the tradition of the discipline when CX luminaries like De Vlaeminck and Van Der Poel (Sr) were probably more famous for their exploits on asphalt.

    There has since been a noticeable decoupling of the disciplines, which in turn reflects the increasing specialisation of cycling, although I am sure there are other reasons. Top CXers who have shown promise on the road - one thinks of Boom and Stybar in particular - have had more or less to abandon their careers in the mud, while the likes of Pauwels and Vantornout ride the road only for training.

    This is just to explain that Nys is quite credible when he says that a big, mixed-discipline team like Rabobank left guys like he and Groenendaal alone. That said, there is plenty of evidence contemporary to the early part of his career which suggests CXers supplied themselves outside of an institutional doping context and we know that Leinders was also a facilitator, someone who would happily test your haematocrit and give you advice on keeping it low.

    All of this at a time when whereabouts were not enforced, when indeed being left to one's own devices without scrutiny would be a serious Dark Side advantage.
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  • Dim

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    Re: Nys and Leinders ...
    « Reply #8 on: January 28, 2015, 14:29 »
    actually in some ways I would kinda buy that.

    If you dont ask, they wont push it on you (unless you are trying to ride GT's).


    Until you read the reasoned decision where at least one rider claims the reason (he thinks) his contract wasnt renewed was because he refused to dope.
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