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Re: Darkside - General news
« Reply #1110 on: October 09, 2014, 11:28 »
https://de.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/radsport-jaksche-doping-teil-systems-132035799.html

Jaksche says nothing has changed, compares cyclists to hookers no one cares about, the "pimps" are still the same as ever before.

(the full interview has not been published yet as far as I can see)

the full interview is online now

its interesting, it basically is a feature about Rick Zabel, but his management has not allowed them to publish all answers that were related to doping and to his father, so only 1/3 of the initial interview was left - therefor they just called Jaksche instead and published an article about Rihs and the Phonak-BMC connection :P

http://www.brandeins.de/archiv/2014/vertrauen/rick-zabel-radsport-vertrauen-unterm-rad.html

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  • "If this is cycling, I am a banana"

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1111 on: October 09, 2014, 11:39 »
    Interesting choice of a headline by the way, "Unterm Rad" (or "Beneath the Wheel" in English) is a novel by Hermann Hesse, criticizing education being too much performance oriented
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1112 on: October 21, 2014, 09:42 »
    Crankpunk, has a say re Thor and his Armstrong comments,  http://crankpunk.com/2014/10/21/4682/

    The whole Armstrong focus is really doing my head in , well more everyday

    Thor says

    32 people say you should have told the world about the devil


    world goes quiet

    people need to be anti doping or not already, the whole anti-LA fanboys are doing my head in, same way the LA fanboys used too

    Ps why hasn't someone asked Thor what other riders he knew were doping and said nothing?

    /
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  • Of course, if this turns out someday to be the industry standard integrated handlebar-computer-braking solution then I'll eat my kevlar-reinforced aerodynamic hat.

    Larri Nov 12, 2014

    just some guy

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    L'arri

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1114 on: October 22, 2014, 11:07 »
    http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/10/news/armstrong-former-usps-riders-reunite-weekend-gran-fondo-hincapie_349986

    Ho Hum

    A nice ethical conundrum, both sides of which I can appreciate. Or is it?

    For me, this is all about good old American chumminess. Europeans would be more subtle about these things generally. We didn't have a full article about that French end-of-season annual football game. Clearly, VN made a lot of phone calls to generate this one.

    Alex Howes though ...

    Quote
    I don’t know. I feel like I’m playing kind of the ignorance card when I say I don’t really think about it. But I really don’t. Like those guys, guys like Vande Velde and Hincapie and Zabriskie and that Lance guy

    "that Lance guy"?  :lol

    It's for charity, folks. It's for charity. Just tell yourself that. Charity. All publicity is good, even that generated by a lot of old dopers.

    It'll be a nice day out, riding with enough cycling royalty to fill a sharps container.

    It's for charity. It's for charity. It's for charity.
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  • Cycling is a Europe thing only and I only watch from Omloop on cause I am cool and sh*t
    RIP Craig1985 / Craig Walsh
    RIP KeithJamesMc / Keith McMahon / Larry Sarni

    cj2002

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1115 on: October 23, 2014, 18:38 »
    http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/10/news/usa-cycling-wada-code-armstrong-ride-hincapie-fondo_350330

    And we have the pronouncement... Armstrong can't ride.

    If he does... he'll be...

    Hang on... how do you punish someone who is already banned for life?!
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  • He shook his head sadly and told me that endemic drug use had compelled him to give up a promising career. "Even one small local race, prize was a salami, and I see doping!" - Tim Moore: Gironimo (Riding the Very Terrible 1914 Tour of Italy)

    Jamsque

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1116 on: October 23, 2014, 21:15 »
    http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/10/news/usa-cycling-wada-code-armstrong-ride-hincapie-fondo_350330

    And we have the pronouncement... Armstrong can't ride.

    If he does... he'll be...

    Hang on... how do you punish someone who is already banned for life?!

    Ban them in the next life too. Buddhists HATE it when you do that.
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  • LukasCPH

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1117 on: October 23, 2014, 22:10 »
    http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/10/news/usa-cycling-wada-code-armstrong-ride-hincapie-fondo_350330

    And we have the pronouncement... Armstrong can't ride.

    If he does... he'll be...

    Hang on... how do you punish someone who is already banned for life?!
    Make him write lines?
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    cj2002

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1118 on: October 27, 2014, 09:26 »
    By way of illustration that even those we trust re: doping matters sometimes get other people's sh*t all over them.

    Ross Tucker/@ScienceofSport, who - to my mind - provides the best and most objective analysis of cycling performances amidst the babble of climbing times and VO2max etc. etc., wrote this column in the Times today.



    If that's not big enough, try:

    https://twitter.com/ergospt/status/526653891900088320
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1119 on: October 29, 2014, 19:02 »
    Péraud talks Dark Side ... some of his views seem clear enough ;)

    Translation of extracts from an interview from October 23rd in Le Monde:

    Jean-Christophe Péraud : « If you stop Astana, that's 30 more guys unemployed »

    Is Nibali on a level above everyone?

    Not everyone. Above me, yes. Froome and Contador were out with crashes, Quintana wasn't racing. Perhaps they would have rivalled him. I couldn't.

    So what will you be able to do in the 2015 Tour?

    In theory, I won't improve. If they got worse and I stayed at my level, then why not? But there isn't much chance of that. Technically or on how we run the race perhaps, but physically I can't do any better. I'm 37 years old.

    Do you think there could be suspicions about you after the Tour?

    In my case, no. As for the world of cycling, after what it's been through since 1998, I get it and it saddens me. But there has been some progress since. There's the longitudinal profiling, anti-doping controls and a lot of things have been put in place in cycling so that it gets better, and I think that's paying off. There's also a new generation of riders who started out around the time of Festina and who came up through the clubs with the understanding that doping is cheating. I wouldn't say that cycling is spotless but when I ask myself the question, I reckon 85% of the peloton is clean. I could be wrong, and there are still certainly cheaters, we've seen that with the Iglinskiys at Astana, but there are means to seek out and catch the cheats.

    Have you ever had suspicions?

    Sure. And I still do. A friend was at the Roc d'Azur event. He was eating behind some guys who were going to ride it and who were saying: "Péraud couldn't pull that off himself. He switched to the road so he could dope." Suspicion is easy. I used to think that myself when I was twenty and riding MTB. I was at my level, finishing 20th, not giving myself every means to succeed in terms of training, and I'd just say: "it can't be done, they're all dopers." It's easy just to say that everyone's cheating.

    During the Tour, Nibali kept saying: "it's all in the past". And then a few weeks later, three positives hit his team. Is there a problem with Astana?

    Hard to say and I wouldn't want to throw stones at Astana. We at AG2R-La Mondiale, we're hardly in the position to pass comment, we've had two positives in a year, pretty much, so I can hardly point the finger at Astana. With the Iglinskiys, it's two brothers and they used the same product, you could say it's almost the same case, it certainly doesn't look like organised doping. But I don't know what goes on in the Astana team. Do they have measures in their recruitment to avoid risky individuals?

    Does it prejudice the credibility of anti-doping that former doped riders, like Vinokourov at Astana, remain at the head of teams

    It isn't good for the image. For sure Vino has some history and that gives his team a bad image. But it's his country's team, it's difficult to get rid of him. And I think that cycling, given the situation it's in, can't afford to get rid of a team. We're seeing teams fold one after another. If you stop Astana, that's 30 more guys unemployed.

    Do you believe in Nibali?

    I'll believe in him for the future of our sport. If we're still going to find cheats winning the Tour, the sport can't go on much longer like that. The Tour may well be a great publicity tool for the image of France but eventually the sport will suffer. But I want to trust him.

    So you won't win the Tour de France by default ten years from now?

    I hope not for the sake of cycling. For me, that wouldn't change anything in my life, but it would change a lot for the sport.

    Do you have the same confidence in Froome and Contador

    I don't want to answer that. I don't want to talk about individuals. I don't want to turn anyone against me.

    You no longer have a right to win when you're a cyclist?

    Yes, of course. As soon as you ride a bike, you're suspect. So we count on journalists to relay the message that cycling is a sport like other sports. We're victims of the past.

    How do you end the equation cyclist = doped?

    It takes time. If during thirty years there aren't any more positives, perhaps then we'll be able to stop asking questions about cycling.
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  • Jamsque

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1120 on: October 30, 2014, 01:56 »
    Thirty years sounds about right.
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  • Drummer Boy

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1121 on: October 30, 2014, 02:15 »
    Do you have the same confidence in Froome and Contador

    I don't want to answer that. I don't want to talk about individuals. I don't want to turn anyone against me.

    Hmmm...
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  • cj2002

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1122 on: October 30, 2014, 09:04 »
    Hmmm...

    And yet he was happy to talk about Nibali.

    And Vino.

    And the Iglinskys.

    Hmmm indeed...
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1123 on: October 30, 2014, 10:43 »
    Aye I did a ummm what you mentioned others
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1124 on: November 04, 2014, 08:19 »
    http://www.sbs.com.au/cyclingcentral/news/57237/hill-on-the-rise-after-suspension-setback

    he gets 2 years, but others get 6 months, odd world sometimes,  but seems not too bitter, wish him luck
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1125 on: November 04, 2014, 10:18 »
    http://www.sbs.com.au/cyclingcentral/news/57237/hill-on-the-rise-after-suspension-setback

    he gets 2 years, but others get 6 months, odd world sometimes,  but seems not too bitter, wish him luck

    Now that is the kind of Dark Side story I like to read. Hill must be pretty peeed at his teammate though, who probably only 'fessed up to Hill about the product because Hill got selected for testing. What on earth are these people doing carrying around junk uppers like that?

    Legal highs

    When I was following the Tour of the Gila this year - something I didn't do deliberately, they just happened to be racing on the same road I was driving - the road was littered with these empty capsules. I saw plenty of them because I was forced to drive at a snail's pace for an hour or so.

    Most of them were recognisable caffeine boosters but I guess I am too much of a body-as-temple kind of guy not to find that surprising and unpleasant. The prevalence of road trash corresponded perfectly with the 20km-to-go banner: riders clearly wanted a boost going into the last bit of the race, so right on cue they drop this highly refined, totally synthetic crap for a quick hit. And there's me, thinking even the all-natural gels I use are a bit too processed. :P
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1126 on: November 04, 2014, 14:01 »
    http://www.theouterline.com/the-dog-ate-my-homework/

     Haven't read this, too many numbers to speed read
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1127 on: November 06, 2014, 08:20 »
    http://m.espn.go.com/mlb/story?storyId=11825652

    Ok this is from the MLB A-Rod case, and something I can not remember hearing before,  when taking a pee sample a person should use mid-stream not the start or beginning to lessen the likelihood if testing positive.

    Is that true? Anyone heard that one?
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1128 on: November 06, 2014, 08:51 »
    http://m.espn.go.com/mlb/story?storyId=11825652

    Ok this is from the MLB A-Rod case, and something I can not remember hearing before,  when taking a pee sample a person should use mid-stream not the start or beginning to lessen the likelihood if testing positive.

    Is that true? Anyone heard that one?

    I haven't heard of that and I fail to see what difference it would make. It's not like the particles are big enough to accumulate in the bottom of one's bladder and thereby excrete first.
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1129 on: November 06, 2014, 08:55 »
    Agree makes little sense, but makes you think.......

    This in combo with the wife having do some tests re pregnancy stuff made me think

    she had to give a urine sample 1st pee to get best results.

    most pro have a wake up call 6-7 for anti doping tests, I wonder if this increases the likelihood of postive being the 1st pee?

    Micro dose, lots of water, you would also need to pee to get it out right?
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1130 on: November 06, 2014, 09:01 »
    Agree makes little sense, but makes you think.......

    This in combo with the wife having do some tests re pregnancy stuff made me think

    she had to give a urine sample 1st pee to get best results.

    most pro have a wake up call 6-7 for anti doping tests, I wonder if this increases the likelihood of postive being the 1st pee?

    Micro dose, lots of water, you would also need to pee to get it out right?

    The article you mentioned is talking about during the urination rather than which urination though, isn't it?

    Otherwise yes, I would agree with that. It seems obvious enough that the first urination of the day will probably contain more of the offening particles. The bit I couldn't buy was whether the first part of the urination was more concentrated.

    But the only real loser in all of this is me. This discussion has entirely ruined my breakfast appetite.
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1131 on: November 06, 2014, 09:13 »
    The article you mentioned is talking about during the urination rather than which urination though, isn't it?

    Otherwise yes, I would agree with that. It seems obvious enough that the first urination of the day will probably contain more of the offening particles. The bit I couldn't buy was whether the first part of the urination was more concentrated.

    But the only real loser in all of this is me. This discussion has entirely ruined my breakfast appetite.
    Sorry Laz  :angel

    yes 1 was mid pee, my thoughts were 1st pee of the day.

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  • AG

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1132 on: November 06, 2014, 10:06 »
    First Pee (or FMU = First Morning Urination) is actually quite common in some tests.  Pregnancy tests are a good example - they are much more likely to test posative (if you are posative that is) using FMU ...

    Mid-Stream is also common in some testing.  I remember quite a few tests (though not what for off the top of my head) that required mid-stream urine only.   It can be a bit tricky for women   :-x
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  • LukasCPH

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1133 on: November 06, 2014, 10:38 »
    But the only real loser in all of this is me. This discussion has entirely ruined my breakfast appetite.
    Yep, mine too.
    Why are we even discussing stuff like this? :fp
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  • AG

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1134 on: November 06, 2014, 10:42 »
    lol - my other forum the "trying to conceive" is well and truly enough to put anyone off their food.

    they want to post pics that ... well ... just no one wants to see  :lol

    discussing peeing in a cup is pretty tame
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1135 on: November 06, 2014, 10:57 »
    lol - my other forum the "trying to conceive" is well and truly enough to put anyone off their food.

    they want to post pics that ... well ... just no one wants to see  :lol

    discussing peeing in a cup is pretty tame

    Pics of trying to conceive? Goodness me ... I would ask you to tell us more but of course it's off-topic. ;)
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  • AG

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1136 on: November 06, 2014, 11:01 »
     :lol  pics of trying to conceive sounds all fun ...  :lol


    till you realise that its about fertility, and womens cycles and all kinds of fluids that really shouldnt have pics posted in public  :fp
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1137 on: November 06, 2014, 11:03 »
    :lol  pics of trying to conceive sounds all fun ...  :lol


    till you realise that its about fertility, and womens cycles and all kinds of fluids that really shouldnt have pics posted in public  :fp

    Mmmmm ... fluids ... all kinds of them ... ;)

    ... And somewhere, in the cold, clear air of northern Europe, the faint but nevertheless audible sound of Fus dry-retching.
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  • AG

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1138 on: November 06, 2014, 11:17 »

    ... And somewhere, in the cold, clear air of northern Europe, the faint but nevertheless audible sound of Fus dry-retching.

    .... and my work is done  :P
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  • LukasCPH

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    Re: Darkside - General news
    « Reply #1139 on: November 06, 2014, 11:28 »
    ... And somewhere, in the cold, clear air of northern Europe, the faint but nevertheless audible sound of Fus dry-retching.
    Delicate I may be, but not that delicate. :P
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