collapse

Poll

Is Horner's Vuelta win believeable, in terms of clean racing, in your opinion?


just some guy

  • Fourth Generation humanoid bot
  • Hall of Fame'r
  • Country: 00
  • Posts: 31323
  • Liked: 10901
  • Awards: 2017 Spring Classics CQ game winnerBest Avatar of 2016JSG News Filter Award 2014Poster of 2014Thread of the Year 2013Most Helpful Member 2013Art of Brevity 2012Most helpful member 2012Best member of staff 2012
Re: Chris Horner
« Reply #30 on: September 03, 2013, 17:58 »
  • ReplyReply
  • Of course, if this turns out someday to be the industry standard integrated handlebar-computer-braking solution then I'll eat my kevlar-reinforced aerodynamic hat.

    Larri Nov 12, 2014

    Dim

    • Grand Tour Winner
    • *
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 8403
    • Liked: 3365
      • Velorooms
    • Awards: Race Preview of 2014Best Post 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #31 on: September 03, 2013, 18:02 »
    Nice blog (in danish) on horner

    Quote
    To the untrained eye, it might still be questioned. But for those who have followed the sport closely for a long time, there is little doubt that there is something wrong when we see a performance by the Chris Horner made on 10 Stage of the Vuelta a España.

    There has in my eyes been four of the kind of performance during the year. First there was Mustafa Sayar, who put all competitors to the wall in the Tour of Turkey. So began Danilo Di Luca to flex its muscles early in the Giro, after remaining nearly seven-month break from racing and really had announced that he had stopped his career. His teammate Mauro Santambrogio followed with some - for him - remarkable performance in the mountains.

    All three riders were tested positive for EPO and is now in quarantine. About the same happens to Horner, I could not say. But let's look more closely at the matter......

    http://veloropa.dk/tilfaeldet-chris-horner/
  • ReplyReply

  • just some guy

    • Fourth Generation humanoid bot
    • Hall of Fame'r
    • Country: 00
    • Posts: 31323
    • Liked: 10901
    • Awards: 2017 Spring Classics CQ game winnerBest Avatar of 2016JSG News Filter Award 2014Poster of 2014Thread of the Year 2013Most Helpful Member 2013Art of Brevity 2012Most helpful member 2012Best member of staff 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #32 on: September 03, 2013, 18:02 »
    Good read the above Google does a good enough job
  • ReplyReply

  • Claudio Cappuccino

    • National Champion
    • Country: nl
    • Posts: 919
    • Liked: 779
    • Venga! Venga! Venga!
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #33 on: September 03, 2013, 18:20 »
    Funny how that 'guilty by performance' works.
  • ReplyReply

  • search

    • World Champion
    • *
    • Country: de
    • Posts: 10465
    • Liked: 10718
    • Awards: Member of the year 2016Post of the year 2016KeithJamesMC 2016Member of the year 20152012 CQ Ranking Tour GameAvatar of the Year 2013
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #34 on: September 03, 2013, 18:28 »
    Dim, how does it come Horner still puts a minute into Nibali, you called out to be an obvious doper just four months ago?

    I am not saying Horner is clean, but it just doesn't work that way. Especially not if you are saying Froome is clean.
  • ReplyReply
  • "If this is cycling, I am a banana"

    KeithJamesMc

    • Road Captain
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 1696
    • Liked: 1396
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #35 on: September 03, 2013, 18:39 »
    Who is Veloropa?

    That article seems to imply that he/she was told before the Vuelta that Horner had used his injury period to dope and would be flying at the Vuelta.
  • ReplyReply

  • search

    • World Champion
    • *
    • Country: de
    • Posts: 10465
    • Liked: 10718
    • Awards: Member of the year 2016Post of the year 2016KeithJamesMC 2016Member of the year 20152012 CQ Ranking Tour GameAvatar of the Year 2013
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #36 on: September 03, 2013, 18:57 »
    that's what he is saying, yep. He does not name a source for that though
  • ReplyReply

  • L'arri

    • Is on Dr Search's Green and Grey Diet
    • Grand Tour Winner
    • *
    • Country: be
    • Posts: 7898
    • Liked: 6451
    • Dopeology.org @DopeologyDotOrg @L_arriviste
      • Dopeology.org
    • Awards: Post of the year 2015Best Opening Post 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #37 on: September 03, 2013, 19:00 »
    Who is Veloropa?

    That article seems to imply that he/she was told before the Vuelta that Horner had used his injury period to dope and would be flying at the Vuelta.

    Veloropa is technically "they" but clearly that was an opinion of one of them. I don't know who they are specifically but they organise public events so they can't be too hard to track down. :)
  • ReplyReply
  • Cycling is a Europe thing only and I only watch from Omloop on cause I am cool and sh*t
    RIP Craig1985 / Craig Walsh
    RIP KeithJamesMc / Keith McMahon / Larry Sarni

    Dim

    • Grand Tour Winner
    • *
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 8403
    • Liked: 3365
      • Velorooms
    • Awards: Race Preview of 2014Best Post 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #38 on: September 03, 2013, 19:16 »
    Dim, how does it come Horner still puts a minute into Nibali, you called out to be an obvious doper just four months ago?

    I am not saying Horner is clean, but it just doesn't work that way. Especially not if you are saying Froome is clean.

    Where have i said Horner is a doper? (And where have i said Froome is clean come to that).

    I really dont care if Horner is doping or not, i cant stand the guy, mostly because of his two faced attitude prior to signing for astana and post, his ridiculous defence of Lance even up to last december, his arrogant, self righteous attitude in interviews. The guy is all omerta. Cant stand him.

    Is he doping? Couldnt really care. I kinda hope he is as it increases his chance of being caught.
  • ReplyReply

  • Anthony Moan

    • Ahab the Arab
    • Road Captain
    • Country: cv
    • Posts: 2046
    • Liked: 904
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #39 on: September 03, 2013, 19:32 »
    I am 41 and animal too :D
  • ReplyReply
  • Reverend Fred Saves!!

    KeithJamesMc

    • Road Captain
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 1696
    • Liked: 1396
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #40 on: September 03, 2013, 20:22 »
    Veloropa is technically "they" but clearly that was an opinion of one of them. I don't know who they are specifically but they organise public events so they can't be too hard to track down. :)
    Pretty simple really, guys name is Kim Plesner
    http://veloropa.dk/author/plesner/
    He has also written some interesting stuff on 9-life Riis luck running out
  • ReplyReply

  • AG

    • Monument Winner
    • *
    • Country: au
    • Posts: 6465
    • Liked: 3831
    • Awards: Winner, 2013 National Championships prediction gameFan of the Year 2013
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #41 on: September 04, 2013, 04:24 »
    the lack of media questions about Hormer's performance is puzzling ...

    Froome wasnt as obvious IMO and he got a grilling every time he set foot ... well anywhere.

    why is horner so special?  or is it just because its the Vuelta no one cares?
  • ReplyReply

  • just some guy

    • Fourth Generation humanoid bot
    • Hall of Fame'r
    • Country: 00
    • Posts: 31323
    • Liked: 10901
    • Awards: 2017 Spring Classics CQ game winnerBest Avatar of 2016JSG News Filter Award 2014Poster of 2014Thread of the Year 2013Most Helpful Member 2013Art of Brevity 2012Most helpful member 2012Best member of staff 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #42 on: September 04, 2013, 07:06 »
    the lack of media questions about Hormer's performance is puzzling ...

    Froome wasnt as obvious IMO and he got a grilling every time he set foot ... well anywhere.

    why is horner so special?  or is it just because its the Vuelta no one cares?

    agreed the answer from Rogers was interesting in that it seems they tried once and that is enough

    where Froome is still getting questions.

    Velonews especially should have learnt from last time , and keep digging and reporting
  • ReplyReply

  • just some guy

    • Fourth Generation humanoid bot
    • Hall of Fame'r
    • Country: 00
    • Posts: 31323
    • Liked: 10901
    • Awards: 2017 Spring Classics CQ game winnerBest Avatar of 2016JSG News Filter Award 2014Poster of 2014Thread of the Year 2013Most Helpful Member 2013Art of Brevity 2012Most helpful member 2012Best member of staff 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #43 on: September 04, 2013, 08:48 »
    Fits in here with the discussed yesterday re age

    Do Winners Get Older?

     Table 2. Ranking of oldest winners WorldTour level races last 10 years makes for ugly reading
  • ReplyReply

  • KeithJamesMc

    • Road Captain
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 1696
    • Liked: 1396
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #44 on: September 04, 2013, 09:42 »
    So Rest Day over and I cannot see no major interviews with Horner in the press. Plenty with other people. Very disappointing.

    Only taste of doubt is this article from Blazing Saddles in the Roar which basically says if Horner podium's then the press should question him.
    http://www.theroar.com.au/2013/09/04/should-we-be-excited-or-worried-by-red-hot-horner/
  • ReplyReply

  • just some guy

    • Fourth Generation humanoid bot
    • Hall of Fame'r
    • Country: 00
    • Posts: 31323
    • Liked: 10901
    • Awards: 2017 Spring Classics CQ game winnerBest Avatar of 2016JSG News Filter Award 2014Poster of 2014Thread of the Year 2013Most Helpful Member 2013Art of Brevity 2012Most helpful member 2012Best member of staff 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #45 on: September 04, 2013, 09:43 »
    So Rest Day over and I cannot see no major interviews with Horner in the press. Plenty with other people. Very disappointing.

    Only taste of doubt is this article from Blazing Saddles in the Roar which basically says if Horner podium's then the press should question him.
    http://www.theroar.com.au/2013/09/04/should-we-be-excited-or-worried-by-red-hot-horner/

    1 - Horner says no surprises to his leading Vuelta at 41

  • ReplyReply

  • KeithJamesMc

    • Road Captain
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 1696
    • Liked: 1396
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #46 on: September 04, 2013, 09:51 »
    1 - Horner says no surprises to his leading Vuelta at 41



    Thanks. I missed that.

    So this is Horner's stance
    Quote
    “There’s no way to answer that,” Horner told VeloNews. “There’s nothing I can say or do to satisfy everyone. I’m not even going to try. At 41, I know people will have their doubts. There’s no way to convince everyone. I’m 41 years old, I’m leading the Vuelta, people can believe it or not.”

    Basically, Horner doesn't care what other people think.

    I think this is an unique approach.
  • ReplyReply

  • Tuart

    • Pobblebonk
    • Road Captain
    • Country: tl
    • Posts: 2046
    • Liked: 489
    • Awards: Velogames Giro Winner 2014
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #47 on: September 04, 2013, 10:42 »
    Unique? I think DILLIGAF mentality has its roots in Australia :P
  • ReplyReply
  • 2014 Velorooms Giro d'Italia Velogames Winner

    L'arri

    • Is on Dr Search's Green and Grey Diet
    • Grand Tour Winner
    • *
    • Country: be
    • Posts: 7898
    • Liked: 6451
    • Dopeology.org @DopeologyDotOrg @L_arriviste
      • Dopeology.org
    • Awards: Post of the year 2015Best Opening Post 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #48 on: September 04, 2013, 11:11 »
    Unique? I think DILLIGAF mentality has its roots in Australia :P

    Not being "down tight with da kidz" these days, I had to look that up. It stands for "Do I Look Like I Give A F***?" if anyone else was wondering. Cheers, Tu!  :D
  • ReplyReply

  • Jimmythecuckoo

    • Genius James
    • Road Captain
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 1538
    • Liked: 799
    • Original Fendrien...
      • Fendrien
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #49 on: September 04, 2013, 11:26 »
    Wow Astana and Saunier Duval in his past...
  • ReplyReply
  • The fens are just West West Flanders really...

    froome19

    • Classics Winner
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 4933
    • Liked: 2046
    • Awards: 2015 National Championships Prediction Game Champion
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #50 on: September 04, 2013, 11:33 »
    Thanks. I missed that.

    So this is Horner's stance
    Basically, Horner doesn't care what other people think.

    I think this is an unique approach.
    I don't know if it is not caring but he seems tired with it all. He isn't going to win over the doubters and for good reason at that, so what is the point in getting embroiled in it at all?
  • ReplyReply
  • RIP Keith

    Anthony Moan

    • Ahab the Arab
    • Road Captain
    • Country: cv
    • Posts: 2046
    • Liked: 904
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #51 on: September 04, 2013, 22:44 »
    And Chris is riding Adamo saddle like me also!
    Does anyone see coincidence between Chris and Tony? :D
  • ReplyReply

  • just some guy

    • Fourth Generation humanoid bot
    • Hall of Fame'r
    • Country: 00
    • Posts: 31323
    • Liked: 10901
    • Awards: 2017 Spring Classics CQ game winnerBest Avatar of 2016JSG News Filter Award 2014Poster of 2014Thread of the Year 2013Most Helpful Member 2013Art of Brevity 2012Most helpful member 2012Best member of staff 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #52 on: September 05, 2013, 09:44 »
    Not sure if it was meant how I read it but anyways

    from Pinotti´s diary

    The other big news about that day was Chris Horner’s win. He has been going very strongly in the climbs, achieving the highest performance of the peloton. He has a pattern to his racing career, the fact that he is able to come back strongly after being away from racing with an injury.

    If you saw his career after 2008 or 2009, he had a lot of small injuries. Each time, he comes back very strong after that.

    From what I can see, he is a high responder to training.

    Read more: http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/15403/Marco-Pinottis-Vuelta-a-Espana-diary-Quiet-time-trial-due-to-illness.aspx#ixzz2e0RClSKw
  • ReplyReply

  • KeithJamesMc

    • Road Captain
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 1696
    • Liked: 1396
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #53 on: September 05, 2013, 10:20 »
    I may not be good at reading between the lines, but I didn't see anything bad in "From what I can see, he is a high responder to training". I just read it as Horner has returned to a high level after an injury before.

    I was scratching my head about the comment on Horner's "unique" climbing style. Pinotti thought it was something to do with Horner's height/weight ratio ie Quite tall with low weight. I think Wiggin's must also have have a high height/weight ratio, but he always prefers to climb in the saddle. 
  • ReplyReply

  • just some guy

    • Fourth Generation humanoid bot
    • Hall of Fame'r
    • Country: 00
    • Posts: 31323
    • Liked: 10901
    • Awards: 2017 Spring Classics CQ game winnerBest Avatar of 2016JSG News Filter Award 2014Poster of 2014Thread of the Year 2013Most Helpful Member 2013Art of Brevity 2012Most helpful member 2012Best member of staff 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #54 on: September 05, 2013, 10:46 »
    I may not be good at reading between the lines, but I didn't see anything bad in "From what I can see, he is a high responder to training". I just read it as Horner has returned to a high level after an injury before.

    I was scratching my head about the comment on Horner's "unique" climbing style. Pinotti thought it was something to do with Horner's height/weight ratio ie Quite tall with low weight. I think Wiggin's must also have have a high height/weight ratio, but he always prefers to climb in the saddle.

    maybe but when I read High responder ......
  • ReplyReply

  • killswitch

    • Road Captain
    • Country: 00
    • Posts: 2031
    • Liked: 1120
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #55 on: September 06, 2013, 00:02 »
    BB come on Horner has much  better images

    Ponny tail and this classic -
    the picture with the ponytail and another one with the epic beard




  • ReplyReply
  • Joelsim: The huge winner today - Landa.
    just some guy: Aye he marginal gained the flip out of it

    KeithJamesMc

    • Road Captain
    • Country: gb
    • Posts: 1696
    • Liked: 1396
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #56 on: September 06, 2013, 09:46 »
    Chris Horner publishes his SRM data for the Stage 10 mountain top win.
    http://www.srm.de/news/road-cycling/vuelta-a-espana-stage-10/

    I don't think he would have done that if there was anything abnormal with the performance
  • ReplyReply

  • Anthony Moan

    • Ahab the Arab
    • Road Captain
    • Country: cv
    • Posts: 2046
    • Liked: 904
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #57 on: September 06, 2013, 10:24 »
    Chris Horner publishes his SRM data for the Stage 10 mountain top win.
    http://www.srm.de/news/road-cycling/vuelta-a-espana-stage-10/

    I don't think he would have done that if there was anything abnormal with the performance
    Just dont care about him beeing doped, but power data are way too much overestimated as doping indication, way to much.
    I mean every single sorry ass semi pro and pro on earth has PM, does that solve doping issue? What does it mean 6,4 w/kg?
    Froome hit that on this year TDF. Wait and see per example Bolt, will hit under 9.50 sec soon.

    Tim Kerrison explains that the variables include:

    ” … the gradient of the climb, if they’re climbing solo or in a group, the temperature and humidity, the wind direction, where that climb occurs in a race. And there’s a big difference between a climb that goes from sea level to 1000m, versus one that starts at 1000m and goes to 2000m in the power the athlete can produce. It could be the exact same climb, but depending on the altitude the athlete will produce two very different power outputs.”

    That is I am talking about, http://cyclingtips.com.au/2013/07/can-performance-be-used-as-an-indicator-of-doping/
  • ReplyReply

  • just some guy

    • Fourth Generation humanoid bot
    • Hall of Fame'r
    • Country: 00
    • Posts: 31323
    • Liked: 10901
    • Awards: 2017 Spring Classics CQ game winnerBest Avatar of 2016JSG News Filter Award 2014Poster of 2014Thread of the Year 2013Most Helpful Member 2013Art of Brevity 2012Most helpful member 2012Best member of staff 2012
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #58 on: September 06, 2013, 10:47 »
    Just dont care about him beeing doped, but power data are way too much overestimated as doping indication, way to much.
    I mean every single sorry ass semi pro and pro on earth has PM, does that solve doping issue? What does it mean 6,4 w/kg?
    Froome hit that on this year TDF. Wait and see per example Bolt, will hit under 9.50 sec soon.

    Tim Kerrison explains that the variables include:

    ” … the gradient of the climb, if they’re climbing solo or in a group, the temperature and humidity, the wind direction, where that climb occurs in a race. And there’s a big difference between a climb that goes from sea level to 1000m, versus one that starts at 1000m and goes to 2000m in the power the athlete can produce. It could be the exact same climb, but depending on the altitude the athlete will produce two very different power outputs.”

    That is I am talking about, http://cyclingtips.com.au/2013/07/can-performance-be-used-as-an-indicator-of-doping/

    woah who stole tone´s password and got all serious   :D

    Good points though  :cool
  • ReplyReply

  • Anthony Moan

    • Ahab the Arab
    • Road Captain
    • Country: cv
    • Posts: 2046
    • Liked: 904
    Re: Chris Horner
    « Reply #59 on: September 06, 2013, 11:39 »
    lol I can be serious sometimes :D
    What is really I am concerned is not Horner or Froome but one avg Joe Slovenian amateur guy, 39 yrs old who avg 49.2 km/h on 18.6 km flat TT course for 22 min 40 seconds! I did for 27 min 25 sec and 41.7km/h avg speed.

    That guy has better time splits than Slovenian pros :evil: and produced more than 420 watts, and he is skinny guy. That is reason I cant sleep since then :D What does he takes? :evil:
  • ReplyReply

  •  

    * Dark Side Chatbox

    Sorry, this shoutbox does not exist.


    Top
    Back to top