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Dr. Horrible the Mad Elephant Man

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Horse racing is a sport, a sport for horses, just like dog racing is a sport for dogs
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    Jamsque

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    Horse racing is a sport, a sport for horses, just like dog racing is a sport for dogs
    Well sure, if you like, but who cares about sports for animals? Not me, that's for sure.

    AG, motor sports are another tricky grey area. On one hand my argument about bikes just being tools could be carried over to cars/motorbikes, but powered vehicles are orders of magnitude more complex than even the most sophisticated racing bike.
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  • Ram

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    Rooster fighting is a life or death sport here. I was about to write cock fighting but that's a life and death sport around the world.
    Horse racing is a sport, a sport for horses, just like dog racing is a sport for dogs
    Nup, Grand National is a glaring example of why it's not just the horse.
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  • Jamsque

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    The Grand National is a flipping joke.
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  • Ram

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    I love it, it's a beaut of a race.
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  • The Hitch

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    Well in Poland we have a lot of beaches (coast, thousands of lakes and man made lakes in the areas where there are none) and people take.their volleyball seriously there. Often 2 people will bring their own nets and just spend hours rallying. thfindoor version of the game is given significant attention in schools. whein august 2 polish men got to like the semis of the euros and it was big news, the main sports story. the level played in fun games on the beaches is quite high.

    Hell even advertisers during the summer focus on beach volleyball eg this powerade ad where a guy flew 10 feet into the air to hit a smash after drinking the.blue magic and coca cola focuses on it a lot too.

    And i know that the sport has similar standing in several southern European countries in some areas pf the us and most importantly in Brazil. not just a sexy sport imo.
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  • Despite the self-serving data benders and associated propaganda to the contrary, I am led to believe that there are pockets of organised, highly sophisticated dopers, even within 'new age' cycling teams. Personally, I don't accept that the 'dark era' has ended, it has just morphed into a new guise.

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    Nope, sport is about humans and humans only. Horses ain't people, horse racing ain't sport.
    equeatrianism isn't the racing of horses though.
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  • Ram

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    We'd get coverage if India did well in any sport apart.
    It's only my opinion, definitely not gospel.
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  • Jamsque

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    What EVAH. Race them, jump over things on them, ride them around in silly clothes, whatever. Ain't sport. Just horsing around (lawl).

    I am going to back out of this discussion now because I think I've said all I can usefully say. Also my opinions are totally coloured by my dislike for horses and horse people.
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  • Tuart

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    The Grand National is a fornicating joke.

    I agree!
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    Zam

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    « Last Edit: March 28, 2012, 13:07 by zam »

    AG

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    what about something like Bowls?   it doesnt exactly require a lot of physical exertion
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  • Dr. Horrible the Mad Elephant Man

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    Is chess boxing a sport?

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    Cycman: Sagan Greipel Brajkovic Breschel CA.Sorensen Porte Wegmann Sutton Zubeldia Fedrigo Lastras Roux Selig Morabito Dumoulin T.Meyer
    CQ game-breakers: Boom Ciolek DeGendt Steegmans Bertagnolli Blythe Masciarelli Stetina Boeckmans Vaugrenard

    bicing

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    What about the cycling domestique, if they are not racing for victory, does it make them not sportsmen?
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  • Capt_Cavman

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    What about the cycling domestique, if they are not racing for victory, does it make them not sportsmen?
    I think there's a good case for awarding a team medal rather than an individual one.
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  • AG

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    it is a problem in cycling.

    Cycling is a team sport - yet the individual is honored with the win, the glory and the medals
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  • Anthony Moan

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    Tony - I am not actually saying they arent sports.  I think many of those sports are great ....

    and I actually was the one saying beach volleyball IS a sport and should be there too  ;D

    hmm - so under your definition, is cycling a sport?       :P

    Yes I understand you AG, beach volleyball is physically more demanding sport than indoor volleyball, and it is great IMHO. 
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  • « Last Edit: March 28, 2012, 15:14 by Anthony Moan »
    Reverend Fred Saves!!

    Anthony Moan

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    The impact of equipment on results is a tricky one to bring in ...

    I was watching one of the major (non-World Cup) 50km classic ski races a month or so back and a number of the top competitors in both mens and womens competitions dropped out of contention because their grip wax was wrong. That meant that they went out the back at the slightest hint of a hill - and effectively were racing against the top amateurs by about 1/3 the way in ...

    So, since equipment - or more correctly, equipment set up - can have such a major impact on the race, does that bring XC skiing into some kind of gray zone??

    And as for the original question about what makes an elite sport that qualifies for the Olympics ... To my (incredibly cynical) mind, the answer is simple ...

    How much money can the corrupt little gnomes at the IOC make out of including the event in the Games line up?

    I mean, you only have to look at some of the choices that they've made over the years - such as the one to include rugby sevens (the circuit makes good money - far more than the 15 a side game/"World Cup" - and importantly holds events in the Middle East and US, so has potential access to sponsor dollars) and even the inclusion of tennis (how much money sits with that sport??) to see what the motivation is ...


    Well you are on some lead for sure, but money is not all, F1 would never become Olympic sport, like NBA players did not allowed to play at games. Sponsors, TV rights, Red bull dude owner all those things maters.

    About training aids or requisite, it is all sport strategy, sometimes you loose sometimes you win.
    Sailing is wonderful sport, and people often think it does not require to be fit.

    F1 drivers, take a look at Button 2:14:14 at olympic distance tri is great time for F1 driver, so some of the sports we never consider as tough are really demanding. There is a story behind those 10 or 15 seconds of competition time.

    World champion high jump coach of Blanka Vlašić (her father) before couple of years ago publicly accused world and olympic champion coach of Ivica and Janica Kostelić (skii) that skiing is silly sport (hilarious), of course debate was harsh, which sport is harder.
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  • Anthony Moan

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    Carrying bricks up ladders is hard work too. Doesn't make it a sport though.

    AG, the point of differentiation between cycling and horse racing is that the bike is just a tool that the human athlete uses, like a running shoe or a javelin. Yes, there are some differences between bikes that can lead to minor advantages for one competitor or another, but nothing like the differences between horses make in a horse race.

    Horses are like humans runners, they train, they have been tested on lactic acid to see is there any potential for them, they rest, they peak, they win or they loose, just can not see difference between horses and humans training.
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  • Arb

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    By my methods, freestyle skiing and figure-skating are sports but should not be Olympic sports.

    That Darts thing annoys me but I'm not sure I can re-phrase my rule to exclude it without excluding too much else.

    Darts isn't any different than other target games like shooting and archery (to a lesser extent curling, bowls and pool).

    Personally I find the subjective categorisation of "what is and what isn't a sport" a bit futile, it's impossible to draw a line.
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  • Ram

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    Horses are like humans runners, they train, they have been tested on lactic acid to see is there any potential for them, they rest, they peak, they win or they loose, just can not see difference between horses and humans training.
    Sage, horse racing requires extreme skill on part of the jockey too. Not any midget can become a jockey. It may not be glaringly obvious but tactics are also vital in these races, an early push almost cost Frankel, the top horse around these days, a race in the Ascot (not sure which, may have been the St James Palace stakes, Frankel just wins every race nowadays). Of course, equestrian and not horse racing are olympic sports, but it can't be written off as not a sport.
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  • Anthony Moan

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    Your comment about NBA players not being at the games is wrong. LeBron James and Kobe Bryant were both at Beijing for example. In fact, the entire US team is/was NBA pro.

    As for F1 never being an olympic sport - that has more to do with practicality than any purity of motive by the IOC I would suggest. I mean, how many takers would there be to host the games if you knew that you had to spend almost as much again as it cost to build all of the other venues on building a race track??

    I am completely with you on the fitness level of the top motor(bike - also) racers. A friend of mine who was a pro MTBer was fitness trainer for a couple of top moto-X racers (one former 500cc world champ) and said that they could well challenge him on the bike for fitness. Similarly, I remember Aaron Slight kicking arse in a TV series that pitted top sports people against each other on an obstacle course. (Apparently the others all teased him before hand - especially the rugby boys - and he returned the favour after the races when he'd beaten them and they were sitting there throwing up ... He came second overall to Steve Gurney - an absolute fitness machine of a multisporter.) The list goes on - Webber and his multi-sport race in Tasmania, Bayliss races bicycles, etc. ...

    No no Beijing or Sydney, I am talking about Moscow 1980 (ex Yugoslavia took gold) and earlier games,  they did not allowed pro NBA to take part, as pro boxers; Ali when amateur took gold at Rome, but pros never allowed to compete (silly if you ask me) that is why we have that Felix Savon (some said even better than Ali) domination or Teofil Stevenson, it would be great that we had a chance to watch those matches against Ali or Fraizer at Olympics.

    F1 track everyone had, it is not at Olympic town but every country has, and IMHO it would not require new track for games (do not know how far is Silverstone from London), of course it is not option for those who have not track.
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  • Anthony Moan

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    Sage, horse racing requires extreme skill on part of the jockey too. Not any midget can become a jockey. It may not be glaringly obvious but tactics are also vital in these races, an early push almost cost Frankel, the top horse around these days, a race in the Ascot (not sure which, may have been the St James Palace stakes, Frankel just wins every race nowadays). Of course, equestrian and not horse racing are olympic sports, but it can't be written off as not a sport.
    They are midget indeed ::)
    Even harder for jockey and horse are XC races, horses are dying there, and jockeys are at their best, it is not that simple as it looks, it takes hours and hours in saddle too. :wave
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  • Ram

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    We don't get any cross country races here. The challenge to man and horse is one of the reasons I watch the Grand National every year. It isn't everyone's cup of tea, but so too the case with cycling and any other sport.
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  • Anthony Moan

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    We don't get any cross country races here. The challenge to man and horse is one of the reasons I watch the Grand National every year. It isn't everyone's cup of tea, but so too the case with cycling and any other sport.
    It is nightmare here at Olympic Committee (who invented that nasty word Jesus) :fp, which sport is greater and should be financed better.

    Example: we took 1998 football world cup bronze, basketball silver at Barcelona against Dream team one and 4 Olympic medals (three golds) at Salt Lake city winner Janica Kostelić, VS Kišerlovski "ONLY" 10th place at Giro!!!

    If you ask me Kišerlovski or someone else top ten place at Giro is equivalent of those success. But no one gave a sh*t here, cos it is not football :-X
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  • Anthony Moan

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    Reminds me of this, it was a pretty good watch...

    Vlada can talk what ever he wants, but this picture talk what he feels about my country he took/steal Croatian flag in finals 1990 at Argentina (Yugoslavia vs USSR) from one Croat (Argentina based supporter).
    He was friend with Dražen Petrović, but for me it is to late for his tears.
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  • Ram

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    It is nightmare here at Olympic Committee (who invented that nasty word Jesus) :fp, which sport is greater and should be financed better.

    Example: we took 1998 football world cup bronze, basket ball silver at Barcelona against Dream team one and 4 Olympic medals (three golds) at Salt Lake city winner Janica Kostelić, VS Kišerlovski "ONLY" 10th place at Giro!!!

    If you ask me Kišerlovski or someone else top ten place at Giro is equivalent of those success. But no one gave a sh*t here, cos it is not football :-X
    Yes, but the Giro wasn't an Olympic Committee event. Those results don't matter, it's the same in most countries (definitely here), not only Croatia. :fp
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  • Anthony Moan

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    Yes, but the Giro wasn't an Olympic Committee event. Those results don't matter, it's the same in most countries (definitely here), not only Croatia. :fp
    Probably
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  • The Hitch

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    I think there's a good case for awarding a team medal rather than an individual one.

    Its a seperate debate but I always believed the team should accompany a winning rider to the podium.
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