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L'arri

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Patrik Sinkewitz
« on: June 21, 2012, 17:43 »
Patrik Sinkewitz has succeeded in his appeal to the German Sports Court in Koeln over his 2011 HGH positive.



http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sinkewitz-cleared-of-hgh-doping-charges
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    L'arri

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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #1 on: August 28, 2013, 19:49 »
    As the great Search pointed out just now in the shoutbox, Sinkewitz' CAS hearing should have started today. If you recall, Patrik was let off by a Koeln court and allowed to race but the German anti-doping authority appealed to CAS (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sinkewitz-cleared-of-hgh-doping-charges).

    I had one source, dateline Lausanne published today, talk about the case but it does not give any details as to whether there's actually a correspondent present (I suspect not):

    http://www.lauterbacher-anzeiger.de/sport/national_und_international/radsport/13393374.htm

    Meanwhile, Patrik is clearly feeling Konfident bekause he has posted his Race Skedule for nekst week on Fäcebruck.
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #2 on: August 28, 2013, 20:24 »
    short background info on this:

    last year in june a german sports arbitral court has cleared SInkewitz because the tests for HGH were not accurate enough and the NADA did not want to unveil how those limits are determined. According to the judge the whole process lacks transparency and fundamental legal principles were harmed by not informing the defendant about for the lawsuit relevant facts. The whole decision is available online (in german):

    http://www.dis-sportschiedsgericht.de/Material/DIS-SV-SP-05-11-Schiedsspruch_v._19.6.2012.pdf

    the NADA did appeal at the CAS, which is why there are the current hearings. According to Sinkewitz' lawyer the NADA did refuse to continue the proceedings at the CAS in german, eventhough all records are. Therefor everything had to be translated and Sinkewitz had to ante up enormous costs for translations and international lawyers

    Sinkewitz also requested his HGH values to be retested with tests of new standard, but NADA denied.
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  • "If this is cycling, I am a banana"

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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #3 on: February 23, 2014, 17:38 »
    As the great Search pointed out just now in the shoutbox, Sinkewitz' CAS hearing should have started today. If you recall, Patrik was let off by a Koeln court and allowed to race but the German anti-doping authority appealed to CAS (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sinkewitz-cleared-of-hgh-doping-charges).

    I had one source, dateline Lausanne published today, talk about the case but it does not give any details as to whether there's actually a correspondent present (I suspect not):

    http://www.lauterbacher-anzeiger.de/sport/national_und_international/radsport/13393374.htm

    Meanwhile, Patrik is clearly feeling Konfident bekause he has posted his Race Skedule for nekst week on Fäcebruck.

    took them "just" half a year, tomorrow is the day of the decision to be made public

    http://www.tas-cas.org/en/infogenerales.asp/4-3-6970-1092-4-1-1/5-0-1092-15-1-1/
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #5 on: February 24, 2014, 16:17 »
    statement by Sinkewitz' lawyer (in german):

    http://www.patriksinkewitz.de/pressemitteilung/
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #6 on: February 26, 2014, 09:08 »
    a more balanced view on the Sinkewitz case from today's Süddeutsche Zeitung

    Quote
    (gt) A verdict and open questions

    The Sport Court Cas banned the cyclist Patrick Sinkewitz for doping with growth hormone for eight years.
    But the core question of the validity of the HGH test, which is doubted by experts, wasn't put further into question by the judges.

    Munich - The Supreme Court of Sport Cas has Patrick Sinkewitz closed due to sports fraud with the growth hormone HGH eight years , the career of the convicted as a repeat offender 33 -year-old has ended. Unless his lawyer Rainer Cherkeh still attracts Swiss Federal Court against the Cas - judgment Sinkewitz ' acquittal by the German sports arbitration DIS conceded and had followed the request of the German Anti -Doping Agency . Nada Counsel Lars Mortsiefer was relieved " that the long and complicated process has now been completed. The decision confirms our interpretation of the law , of which we have never deviated . It is also a proof that it pays to have staying power . " However, in this first prominent HGH case of sport in general , many questions remain open.

      February 2011 Sinkewitz had tested positive in a race in Lugano on HGH and suspended by the world governing body UCI . After intensive evidence but granted DIS single Judge Willi Erdmann, former Senate chairman of the Federal Court , an acquittal : were too strong doubts about the scientific reliability of the HGH tests, also irritated him the role of Nada: " To effectively fight against doping is one of transparency ," admitted he controlled by the German sports agency along the way .

      The inserted at Sinkewitz 2011 HGH test was based on limits , the occurrence doubt well-known experts . Presented by opinion of the endocrinologist Lorenz Hofbauer ( University of Dresden) biomathematical the basics of limit value calculation significantly in question : That this expertise no input into the CAS process was , without any justification , brings lawyer Cherkeh in rage. " Shockingly thin and superficial," was the verdict, not only because the length of the reasoning was only only eleven pages.

      "As a pharmacologist , I share these concerns ," says the Nuremberg expert Fritz Soergel . From the Research Experience for drugs he knew how " can be manipulated by subjective selection of data , including through action or omission of those limits in a desired direction ." According Cherkeh by the counterparty Wada ( World Anti -Doping Agency ) has commissioned McGill University in Montreal working with data that has been classified by Sinkewitz ' experts ' from serious reasons to be scientifically untenable " . There is considerable another objection , which refers to sports policy networks : Chancellor of McGill University for many years was Richard Pound , the founding president of Wada .

      Difficult to understand even for the novice a situation , the Cherkeh is particularly emphasized : The Cas had never permitted Sinkewitz to use a new , from the Wada already in 2012 used as a "reliable" HGH test to follow-up the complained blood sample. The cyclist had even demanded as soon as he had been acquitted at first instance . The Nada refused to.

      Why should Sinkewitz come an improved HGH test benefit if he had doped? The denial of a post-test will not fit the supposedly hard -Fraud , the last out came the organized sports in Sochi - but it fits into the sports policy calculus . As regards the fight against doping , the storage time for Olympic doping samples was just increased only from eight to ten years. Justification of Wada : In ten years there improved analytical methods for substances that are hardly or not at all to be found today . Had an improved HGH - retest again with positive result to Sinkewitz not enormous cost and effort saving - and increases the credibility of the anti-doping campaign ?

      Before Cas suddenly became apparent that the new test but should not be so great: He let namely a twelve hour time window (just before blood sampling ) open. This puts the cheering news of doping fighters in 2012. On the other hand : When Sinkewitz asked for the posttest , he knew not that a time window remains open in the new process . Especially since all requests to remain unanswered . Cherkeh says the test would have enlightening and can provide " exculpatory evidence in addition ."

      The judgment shows the way, what dangers threaten the system of self-regulation in sport, a tough anti-doping law in force should be really soon . In disputes to not scientifically clear limits to state courts would hardly retreat to the position that the brave Cas sports judges chose : They would " not scientific to evaluate the process of threshold determination" and could " limit the present expert testimony " on the weighting - where Hofbauer was missing. Unlike the lower court , the question of how the limits came about was , " hidden content " , complains Cherkeh . What remained was a kind of nursery rhyme : Who could muster more professionals ?

      Cherkeh goes " assume that Sinkewitz will appeal to the Swiss Federal Court , above all, the right to a hearing was repeatedly blatantly violated ." He refers to the " unfounded rejection of endocrine opinions, which have completely relieved Sinkewitz "
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #7 on: March 13, 2014, 08:43 »
    http://www.radsport-news.com/sport/sportnews_86276.htm (DE)

    Sinkewitz to start today in Istrian Spring Trophy

    Yes, folks: in a macabre twist from the Grand Theatre of Farce that is our sport, reports are that Patrik Sinkewitz will start today's Istrian Spring Trophy on the hallowed turf of Tony Moan.

    Sinkewitz, known to nobody except me as the "Hormones from Hesse", aims to exploit a loophole in his 8-year ban by brandishing a Croatian licence and claiming that he hasn't yet had official confirmation of his ban.

    It remains to be seen whether or not he will get to start this afternoon's 2km prologue in Umag but we can confirm that popcorn orders have increased in the town.
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #8 on: March 13, 2014, 08:45 »
    Is it bad to hope he wins ?
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    L'arri

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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #9 on: March 13, 2014, 08:47 »
    Is it bad to hope he wins ?

    As that great philosopher Silver Bullet once rapped: "This is justice, you can't go rush this"
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #10 on: March 25, 2014, 11:25 »
    the full reasoned decision on the Sinkewitz case is online meanwhile

    http://www.tas-cas.org/d2wfiles/document/7429/5048/0/Award20285720%28FINAL%29.pdf
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #11 on: April 09, 2014, 20:50 »
    Sinkewitz on FB (in german):

    "[Trofeo Laigueglia] was my last race, and thereby also my last Podium (2nd place).

    My aim and wish always was - and still is - to end my career with a win.

    So far I have always reached my personal aims, often on detours, and having to cross several barriers. That was not easy, and it won't be easy this time as well.

    Still, or particulary because of that, sooner or later I will reach that target as well!!!"
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #12 on: June 23, 2014, 09:46 »
    Sinkewitz has started a bit of rant on his Facebook, he is upset the NADA is still sending him e-mails every week reminding him to register for the ADAMS system. He has sent them an e-mail asking if this meant that he was still allowed to compete, but he didn't get an answer at all.

    "how disastrous things are proceeding there is incredible, totally unorganized, they are telling lies, deliberately, and get a lot of money for it, at the expense of the athletes. I have got a lot more of these aburd e-mails."



    "It's just unbelieveable that someone is condemned completely innocent - and 100% proven, in my case. It's nearly impossible to prove your innocence as an athlete - but I did, and it still didn't help. Everyone can become a victim of this, at any time. It's us athletes all all alone against those powerful federations, how can that be, that surely can't be the spirit of the sports. Those federation are that powerful, they can just ignore what anyone else comes up with. [...]

    A solution needs to be found, the situation as it is is not acceptable. I am still left in disbelief, even today, and I'll definitely need time to find a solution. I can't say how it'll look like exactly, but to swollow my anger and surrender is no option at all. The big problem is, that those federation can do what they want to do and are not subject to any kind of regulations.

    We got to wait and see what's going to happen during the next couple of weeks, but a fair solution got to be found, that's for sure.

    Thanks for your support, it's very important for me and gives me a lot of strength and courage to keep fighting for justness."




    "what difference 10 years can make...unblieveable"


    "It's true, and that's a great thing, I have had a lot of success during my career - and I will still have. I have had reached rock bottom, and despite the errors I have made myself, and all opposition I had to face, I still made it back to the top, being stronger than ever before.

    "Life isn't always easy, things don't go the way you expect them to, but in sports everything is even more extreme. When I became a professional cyclist I first thought winning races was hard, and nearly impossible - but in contrary, that's the easiest part of it. Cycling isn't difficult - those other influences are. I never expected them to be important at all, but that's what you got to understand - and that's something no one will teach you. Charecter, that means never giving up, keep fighting till the end. Surely you can't win every single race, but when you finally reach the top again, then you'll understand."
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #13 on: July 31, 2014, 15:45 »


    ehhh
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #14 on: July 31, 2014, 15:54 »
    meanwhile the decision by the CAS is legally binding and absolute by the way, Sinkewitz's appeal has been declined by the swiss Tribunal fédéral

    http://relevancy.bger.ch/php/aza/http/index.php?lang=de&type=show_document&highlight_docid=aza://11-06-2014-4A_178-2014&print=no
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #15 on: October 23, 2014, 09:27 »
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #16 on: June 01, 2015, 13:47 »
    Sinkewitz has not paid those 80000 EUR of court costs he owes NADA

    They might sue him, but are hesitant, as that would mean a German court would need to review the CAS decision and might come to a different result and (same as Claudia Pechstein a couple of years ago) clear Sinkewitz of all charges.

    Quote
    (gt)

    Sinkewitz annoys the final authority

    Cas again threatened by a review of a national court


    Munich - What is brewing just at the National Anti-Doping Agency (NADA), only appears awkward at second glance. At first it's all about a debt of nearly EUR 80 000, which has the Nada over an alleged doping offenders. But behind it conceals the question of whether the sport in Germany soon, a second "case Pechstein" threatens: that a national civil court could make it again to examine a controversial judgment of the International Court Sport (CAS).

      Last year, the Cas had the cyclist Patrik Sinkewitz banned for alleged doping with growth hormone HGH for eight years; He was also obliged to pay nearly EUR 110 000 court costs. The Nada, who was Sinkewitz 'Respondent, submitted EUR 80 000 of them and demanded the athletes in early March on her to settle this display. Only: Sinkewitz let this deadline and will not pay, as he told the SZ through his lawyer Rainer Cherkeh. Since it seems a logical next step that the Nada take further legal action to recover their money: they can confirm his entitlement to such EUR 80 000 to a German court and seeks the enforcement against Sinkewitz. The funds provided are indeed no Peanuts for an organization that has a mainly financed by the federal budget of almost ten million euros - and for years complained a lack of financial resources.

      However, the Nada announces that further action was by no means clear, they are currently eruiere all possibilities. "We consider our success, and we are examining, in which action might what does it cost," says Executive Lars Mortsiefer. The restraint can also be explained by the fact that the case is tricky. Should Nada call a German civil court, the question would probably consider whether the CAS award is recognized. And whose arbitration is advised especially in Germany powerful criticism. Finally, the Munich Higher Regional Court had declared an action for damages against Claudia Pechstein skating World Association admissible: because of the structure of Cas. In addition, the court could also look at how it came to the arbitration award in the case Sinkewitz; so it would illuminate the event and content again. And then maybe come across a number of outstanding issues.

      2007 Sinkewitz was first tested positive, then on testosterone. He received a two-year ban, after he grabbed a witness from peripherally; his revelations helped the systematic doping at Telekom / T-Mobile uncover. After his return to the peloton there were 2011 in a meaningless provincial race in Switzerland again a positive test on Sinkewitz - this time on HGH. Also, the body produces growth hormone, doper it lead to in order to increase performance. That the substance circulating in the field, had long been known; but it was almost never found. Many experts consider the HGH test as quasi ineffective. Since it became the father of ironic that just a been tested in large parts of the cycling world as a traitor outlaw Doping witness first professional positive effect on HGH. Sinkewitz denied any manipulation. And the German Sports Arbitration (DIS) acquitted him, in the person of former Federal Judge Willi Erdmann. But the Nada took the case to the CAS, and there was the verdict: guilty of doping as a repeat offender.

      Sportrechtler irritated the verdict for many reasons. As is the arbitrariness, as the Cas handle the testing procedures. Shortly before the Causa Sinkewitz the Estonian cross-country skier Veerpalu had been acquitted by a judge trio because after his conviction (such as after the DIS) the limits were not properly screened in the applied test method. To Causa Sinkewitz but decided another trio, and was, the scientific determination of the limits is not for the Cas. The core question of how valid the doubted by experts HGH test was and is, the sport Judge went not after.

      When HGH test are in principle not only two samples (A and B), but four: the A and B sample will be divided into two so-called kit. Only if all four are striking and the values ​​of all the A and B samples are almost identical, there is a violation. In Sinkewitz deviated from a Kit value of the B sample by up to 35 percent of the comparative figures. As such a deviation is scientifically possible, remained unclear. The Sportrechtler January Orth also exhibited in an analysis indicates a recognizable even for laymen misunderstanding on the part of the Panel: The wrote in the judgment that it was convinced after hearing the experts that other anti-bodies have been used for determining the values ​​of the B sample be. But that would be inadmissible in the A and B sample must follow the same procedure arise. In the two kits of a sample, however, various anti-bodies are used.

      There are more questionable. The Cas had Sinkewitz never permitted to use a new, by WADA from 2012 used as a "reliable" HGH test for the post of the blood sample complained. The professional had called for his acquittal at first instance itself. The Cas refused Sinkewitz even to present exculpatory opinion. At the same time an appraiser sat down on the opposite side from the suspicion of bias; This is true, according to Orth, Judge at the Landgericht Köln, also for one of the three panel judge who had already previously publicly clear position on the matter.

      All these points could again be the subject of a German court - when the Nada it creates of claiming Sinkewitz the EUR 80 000. If they do not, remain from this process, another serious knowledge, which is not the Arbitration of Sports also beneficial: Then would the high cost for an athlete to the Nada and the sports law system keep a doper, at the end of the German taxpayer are settled.

    http://www.sueddeutsche.de/sport/sportpolitik-sinkewitz-aergert-die-letzte-instanz-1.2470970?reduced=true
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #17 on: August 12, 2015, 14:14 »
    Sinkewitz wanted to talk to CIRC, about concrete past and current doping practices, but they were not willing to send anyone to Germany to talk to him. He also informed Cookson, but he said it's not his business.

    Regarding his ban, he will not stop to fight it, and it will end up to be messy he says - but not for him. The others will have to pay

    http://www.sueddeutsche.de/sport/doping-im-radsport-der-kronzeuge-den-niemand-hoeren-wollte-1.2582100

    here is the full interview (google translated):

    Quote
    (gt)

    "That's a bad joke"

    The cycling has worked his doping history? Are you kidding me? Are you serious when you say that!
    Patrik Sinkewitz would like unpacked before the competent Commission - also about current driver.
    But when it became clear how much he knows, would not hear anything from him

    INTERVIEW: THOMAS KISTNER

    SZ: Mr. Sinkewitz where you can meet more frequently in the last three weeks: in the saddle - or at home watching TV, watch the Tour de France?

    Patrik Sinkewitz: in the saddle, I still ride every day. But the Tour de France I hardly followed on television, already, because I have time other priorities there. It is also perhaps so that I made this operation even know themselves too well one or the other. And as an insider because you can not always believe what you see on TV and hear.

    The tour goes on Sunday to end. What is your impression of the sports tour?

    As I said, I have looked at not much, but I believe that the sporting level has dropped. Not based on the top of the ranking, but to the total field. Some good drivers are not even taking part again.

    Why don they start?

    Since many reasons make you think. From the wishes of many sponsors who prefer to showcase their drivers for exotic cycling countries, to the possibility that some may not want to do to the stress in France, where there is the strongest anti-doping legislation in the world. This stress can also annoy drivers who take nothing himself.

    Do you have an example of such a stress victims?

    We can remember Bradley Wiggins us. The 2012 is not taken up by his grand tour win again because he did not want to do this stress again be.

    Has that changed your estimation in the field of prohibited performance-enhancing drugs to help Understanding compared to the time when you were still active?

    The environment has remained the same. That says it all.

    You mean the sports directors, physicians and caregivers?

    I mean the big picture. Nothing fundamental has changed yet staffed. From cycling's world governing body UCI on the tour organization to the racing stables - the whole cycling has actually not changed noticeably. Apart from the slogans on a new, clean generation, which supposedly is now at the start. But such slogans there already for 17 years.

    Among other things, the lifetime locked Lance Armstrong has recently been very skeptical about the exceptionally strong performances of the Tour favorites Christopher Froome. Share this skepticism - or is now better trained?

    I can not tell. The training methods of Froome I do not know.

    The UCI has indeed set up an internal purity and education program, known as Circ-Commission. There are all sensitive issues of the past, but also the cycling presence should come to the table. Keep the project Circ succeeded for, there was actually a firmly resolute to educate Truth Commission at work?

    I have not read through the report of the Circ exactly. That would be a waste of time.

    Also, you have been asked to testify before the Circ. But nothing came of it at the end, there was not even a meeting. Can you describe what happened and how everything went?

    The Commission has contacted me in June 2014 and asked if I could meet with the people of the Circ. I did the same in the affirmative. In August there were phone calls with the Circ-Commission. The Circ knew from that time, about what specific issues I wanted to tell and how I could support their educational work. Because my offer, what I wanted to testify all that important and even updates concerned, the Circ was only very interested. But a moment later, in August, the contact is interrupted suddenly. I then tried repeatedly over weeks to receive a reply, in writing and by telephone. Only at the end of November, the Circ has then reported back, on my massive insistence, wanted to meet with me then but not in Germany. That was it.

    So you wanted to say about wide-ranging issues - and at the end of this hearing, after the Circ was once submerged for months, failed on the question of where you meet?

    Precisely.

    But the three members of the Circ was but for their doping education a budget of 2.4 million euros. Could they send someone to you not just?

    That makes it so so incomprehensible.

    What was your work drive, with the Circ?

    I have the Circ written immediately after their contact, that I am ready to cooperate, if that is really a serious reappraisal of the past and the present. And that I only do if the Circ an alibi Commission is not just. I have literally written so. I have also written to the people that I will not keep anything from my knowledge, and that also means of course that then maybe one or the other head will roll. Later we talked about a possible substantial penalties reducing my lock, so that I can go as a professional wheel. The lock that the Cas (Supreme Court of Sport in Lausanne;.. D Red) has imposed on me, but is not legally anyway, and I think that people see from the Circ too.

    What would you have to testify in the Circ - only about the past, or even issues that extend into the current time?

    Very concrete facts from the past and present, who would certainly also for some effects. And also things that actors of the UCI and the work of laboratories in terms that are accredited by the World Anti-Doping Agency. The Circ knows the issues about which I wanted to tell. More I can not say this in public.

    Could it be because that the Circ had enough experience on these topics by other witnesses and therefore renounced you? If there are issues in your Circ report, from other sources?

    Without the report in detail to know: I can not imagine for sure.

    Is the impression right that the Circ contact with you dropped out after finding out how far-reaching would be your statements?

    Unfortunately absolutely right.

    Do you think that the CIRC is handled politically sport with your case - that they would rather not know in the end what you have to report on sensitive matters?

    Is bad, that it's probably so. Perhaps because even someone has substantially curtailed. My issues were the people of the Circ only very interested, because just that they were actually there. But I do not know, and it now is I do not care.

    The Circ-members refuse to request any opinion on the case and refer to a duty of confidentiality, which shall give it there.

    I want to have nothing to do with these people. Why should I unload still Confidential there? Never more, because it would not happen anyway. All this was and is a bad joke.

    Have you tried to contact UCI president Brian Cookson?

    Yes, that's what I did. I informed him that the Circ apparently has no interest in my information and contact has also canceled suddenly. He then only replied that the CIRC is independent and that he is not involved as president of the UCI since taking office in anti-doping issues.

    If the services on the one hand and the anti-doping protestations on the other hand to hear from many of the protagonists, who are now in the current Tour de France route: How many drivers and officials take it off, that has really changed?

    As I said: The environment has not changed. And my current experience with Circ and UCI do not give rise to hope for change.

    Do you think you ever completely "clean" can ride around the track today at the Tour de France and other Grand Tours forefront?

    That's hard for me to judge because I dispute currently no race.

    What is the state in terms of your doping suspension for a positive test on a growth hormone?

    My lawyer (Rainer Cherkeh;... Editor's note) has the German Cycling Federation recently written again. I want that the BDR confirmed to me that I, in 2015 received a professional license from BDR despite the CAS judgment, with which I was illegally locked. You know that I was still acquitted in the first instance in Germany. The Cas but then said in his judgment that the crass different values ​​between the A and B sample are arose because at the B-sample to another test method was applied as in the A-sample. This is so blatantly wrong and madness, and the white and the BDR. It's bad that athletes be sent at the end of such judges in the disaster. All independent experts were on my side. The reports, which were completely relieve me, not even admitted by the CAS. The result, ie no doping, did not fit the men from Cas halt. From a national court, I would never have been convicted. I train every day and would continue even further the possibility, again coming in a professional team. If the BDR does not come around in the short term, it comes to compensation, so again before the courts - but this time in front of public. I will not give up. And in the end it will be expensive. But then for others.

    In your opinion, do the German tour riders really stand for the clean fresh start, as they say themselves constantly?

    Would be nice.

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  • Joelsim

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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #18 on: August 12, 2015, 14:32 »
    There have been quite a few stories coming out about CIRC not wanting to spend any money on travelling despite it being 2.4 million. Can't help but feel I could have written it with the same outcome for somewhat less money.

    The Cookson bit in your post, search, is a little misleading. Doesn't it say that they contacted Cookson but he said Sinkewitz should speak to the CIRC as they are the independent body putting this together? As opposed to Cookson wasn't interested.
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #19 on: August 12, 2015, 14:42 »
    well, no, he informed him that CIRC was not willing to talk to him and not interested in his information. What else can he do?! Cookson should have stepped in then and send someone to talk to him if he is really interested.
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  • Joelsim

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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #20 on: August 12, 2015, 14:51 »
    well, no, he informed him that CIRC was not willing to talk to him and not interested in his information. What else can he do?! Cookson should have stepped in then and send someone to talk to him if he is really interested.

    It's an independent report i.e. no UCI intervention
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  • L'arri

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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #21 on: August 12, 2015, 14:54 »
    I find it quite surprising.

    As I have said before, the CIRC even wanted to come to Belgium and talk to me, a nobody in the field. I was told the funds were there to do that. And if I wanted to meet in Lausanne, they said, they could accommodate that.

    Surely Sinkewitz, a reasonably big fish given his background, would have deeply interested the panel.

    I also find it doubtful that the CIRC did not want to create problems for current stakeholders. Zorzoli was the only leftover from Sinkewitz's time and he has gone anyway, albeit with an honourable discharge.
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #22 on: August 12, 2015, 14:54 »
    It's an independent report i.e. no UCI intervention

    I totally disagree. If that independent commission is not interested, the UCI needs to look for a different way to deal with the topic. If he really said "the anti-doping topic is not my business", he should step back immediately.
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #23 on: August 12, 2015, 15:04 »
    I find it quite surprising.

    As I have said before, the CIRC even wanted to come to Belgium and talk to me, a nobody in the field. I was told the funds were there to do that. And if I wanted to meet in Lausanne, they said, they could accommodate that.

    Surely Sinkewitz, a reasonably big fish given his background, would have deeply interested the panel.

    well, what Sinkewitz says is that they stepped back when they realized the extent of his testimony. So that it was not for a lack of funds, but to secure different interests. And if this is true, it's a really big accusation and questions the whole credibility of that investigation.
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  • Joelsim

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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #24 on: August 12, 2015, 15:09 »
    I totally disagree. If that independent commission is not interested, the UCI needs to look for a different way to deal with the topic. If he really said "the anti-doping topic is not my business", he should step back immediately.

    I very much doubt he said that. He will have said the CIRC are producing an independent report on behalf of the UCI. You need to speak to them, not me. A report cannot be independent if the UCI get involved in it.
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #25 on: August 12, 2015, 15:11 »
    probably, yes - that's a very bureaucratic way to deal with it though, if exactly that independent commission already refused to talk to him.
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #26 on: August 12, 2015, 15:53 »
    Sinkewitz wanted to talk to CIRC, about concrete past and current doping practices, but they were not willing to send anyone to Germany to talk to him.
    Conclusion: CIRC regarded L'arri as more important than Sinkewitz. :lol
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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #27 on: August 12, 2015, 16:22 »

    Stinkewitz is a douche. He has always been a douche. He will always be a douche.
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    L'arri

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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #28 on: August 12, 2015, 16:44 »
    Conclusion: CIRC regarded L'arri as more important than Sinkewitz. :lol

    The CIRC used a copy of my database in order to give itself a historical narrative to follow in the early days. That request was made very specifically.

    And I appreciated the panel's problem: three non-cyclists and their assistants were expected to (very quickly) figure out what had happened in pro cycling, a history that we here as VR members may know very well already but not someone more used to investigating war crimes. They needed to take that basic narrative and use it to identify people with whom to discuss doping.

    Many people have since made the inaccurate assumption - based on the hubris of Millar, Froome and a few other talking heads - that it was the individual's obligation to present him or herself to the CIRC and that he or she would be heard. In fact, the CIRC almost certainly approached many more individuals itself, yours truly included. It probably goes without saying what proportion of these individuals were willing to respond.

    Many of these same people have also criticised the value of the CIRC report and given airtime to two or three people who claim to have been ignored while completely failing to condemn the significant but necessarily anonymous number of individuals who, for their own reasons, elected instead to uphold the omerta. If there is any disgrace in the aftermath of the CIRC report, it is surely there in that particularly ugly interpretation of the phrase "silent majority".
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  • « Last Edit: August 12, 2015, 16:58 by L'arri »

    Claudio Cappuccino

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    Re: Patrik Sinkewitz
    « Reply #29 on: August 12, 2015, 17:02 »
     With all due respect, I think it is very telling an independent commission who is to investigate doping in cycling needs to read up, lending a database from volunteers because they are not familiar with the subject?

    Uh, dubious at best.

    @RaceRadio: Sinkewitz is like Kloden, yet, him willing to spill [his] beans should be taken into account imho, for the greater good
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