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al_pacino

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Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
« Reply #30 on: October 01, 2014, 20:33 »
it is the "provisionally suspended" list, so the A-Sample is enough to make it on there I guess

edit: yes, it is, the result from Rabottini's b-sample has not yet been announced as well

Doh me! You make it seem a bit obvious.


Not that it pertains to this thread but there names on that list from nearly 12 months back. What happens to them?
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  • LukasCPH

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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #31 on: October 01, 2014, 21:07 »
    Not that it pertains to this thread but there names on that list from nearly 12 months back. What happens to them?
    There's even a name on that list from 2009! :o
    Erick Castaño, never heard of him. Tested positive in the 2009 Vuelta al Ecuador, and has continued to compete until at least 2012 according to CQranking.
    Somehow I can't believe they only tested his sample three years later ... things don't quite add up here.
    Was his case ever heard? Was he ever actually suspended?
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  • « Last Edit: October 01, 2014, 21:09 by froome19, Reason: fixed link »
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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #32 on: October 01, 2014, 21:08 »
    Alright, here is Astana's press release for Maxim's positive. :-x :lol (/s)

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  • Jamsque

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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #33 on: October 01, 2014, 22:20 »
    New Astana seeming more and more like Old Astana. It's like Johan never left!
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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #34 on: October 01, 2014, 23:22 »
    http://proteam-astana.com/2014/10/01/maxim-iglinskiy-uci-provisional-suspension/

    Quote
    Maxim Iglinskiy – UCI Provisional Suspension

    Astana Pro Team response to UCI confirmation 1.10.14 that Iglinskiy M. cannot participate in competition until adjudication of his case on the merits or the lifting of the provisional suspension by the UCI Anti-Doping Commission or the CAS -

    “Astana Pro Team Management announces an adverse analytical finding for EPO has been registered for rider Maxim Iglinskiy – ‘

    “In accordance with regulations of the MPCC (Mouvement Pour un Cyclisme Crédible) to which the Astana team first adhered in 2013, the rider is suspended provisionally and shall remain out of competition in anticipation of the results from the B analysis -“

    “All Astana Pro Team riders are contractually obliged to respect strict ethical rules and regulations,” said Astana Pro Team General Manager Alexandr Vinokurov -

    ” We will not tolerate any indulgences by any one entity, person or structure that violates these rules – I am very disappointed and angered that this rider could not have understood the basis of our rules and the importance of our ethics -“

    “It is especially unacceptable on the part of a Kazakh rider who stands for the image of our team and the image of our country -“
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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #35 on: October 02, 2014, 02:02 »
    Maxim as well now :o I am Soooooo out of the loop.

    Im assuming Maxim tested positive after using one of Valentins unused blood bags :D
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  • Mellow Velo

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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #36 on: October 02, 2014, 08:24 »
    Old school doping.
    This recent raft of epo positives seem to be happening in clusters amongst a couple of teams.
    Vino talking about strict ethical rules is laughable.
    Riders contracted to them sure, but the teams, especially a top WT team are obliged to make every effort to enforce them.
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  • "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.

    pastronef

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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #37 on: October 02, 2014, 09:39 »
    so finally, will they be able to race Almaty? I hope not  :P
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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #38 on: October 02, 2014, 09:48 »
    Old school doping.
    This recent raft of epo positives seem to be happening in clusters amongst a couple of teams.
    Vino talking about strict ethical rules is laughable.
    Riders contracted to them sure, but the teams, especially a top WT team are obliged to make every effort to enforce them.

    MV

    notsure it is old school doping, as I said before more likely new school testing more sensative finding the positives.

    I really don't think EPO left micro dosing took over, but then the questions is when did taking EPO make you sh*t  :D

    But I agree Vino is hilarious

    I also said on twitter last night, if Pat was still here,  we would be discussing these positives as a way to get Vino to talk to CIRC ;)


    Right who is next from Tinkoff  :lol
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  • Of course, if this turns out someday to be the industry standard integrated handlebar-computer-braking solution then I'll eat my kevlar-reinforced aerodynamic hat.

    Larri Nov 12, 2014

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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #39 on: October 02, 2014, 10:31 »
    Iglinskiy, M was tested one day before competing in the Clasica San Sebastian, having gone straight on to that from the Tour.

    Iglinskiy, V meanwhile was busted ten days later on or just before Stage 1 of the Eneco Tour.

    The eve or morning of races is the classic bust, of course, but two brothers on the same team as a pure coincidence I find unlikely.

    I have written before that, with the recent bio-passport issues (length of investigation, legal challenges), I wonder whether there's an increase in the targeted testing of suspicious individuals, since a positive test suspension is much quicker and less litigious than a bio-passport irregularities bust.

    If so, this is the UCI/WADA partying like it's 2009. Back then, because the profiles were not yet deep enough, there was a spate of Horner-style targeted testing and a fistful of positive tests were announced off the back of the bio-passport before so much as a fluctuation was aggregated.
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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #40 on: October 03, 2014, 10:29 »
    there was a press conference with Vino il Almaty today

    http://bnews.kz/ru/news/post/231784/

    Quote
    (gt)

    "The incident with Maxim, of course, we spoiled the festive mood, but one law for all. When you sign a contract, you must adhere to all the rules of ethics and the rules of procedure commands as well as the international cycling federation. Besides it is signed by the internal regulations in twenty pages. As of today, we are waiting for an official explanation from the rider, and will find out whether he will make a sample «B». Next we will make a decision. However, so far, at the moment, he is suspended from all competitions. His participation in the "Tour of Almaty" was not planned. Once again, to his explanations, he removed all starts, "- said Alexander Vinokourov at a press conference in Almaty.

    Also Vinokurov added that as a team is to MPCC (Association for the pure sport), they are required to adhere to their rules.

    "By law, if confirmed, that the sample« B »showed a positive result, we will have to miss the next« World Tour »in Beijing (" Tour of Beijing ")," - said Alexander Vinokourov.

    so, there's still no one who has talked to Maxim yet. 7 days since notification must be over soon, I doubt he will request a b-sample - looks like Astana will wait for that time to pass by and then take the one week holiday joker for Beijing
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  • lancasterke

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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #41 on: October 03, 2014, 11:21 »
    for any other team this would have been great timing with an excuse to miss Beijing, for the Asian team this could only have been worse just before the tour, if they can finesse this to avoid TDU, but still win their home race and do something in Beijing they'll think it's been rather a good result
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  • cj2002

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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #42 on: October 03, 2014, 11:41 »
    Every time I read "The Iglinsky Family" in the recent posts box etc., in my head I hear this...

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  • He shook his head sadly and told me that endemic drug use had compelled him to give up a promising career. "Even one small local race, prize was a salami, and I see doping!" - Tim Moore: Gironimo (Riding the Very Terrible 1914 Tour of Italy)

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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #43 on: October 03, 2014, 19:07 »
    for any other team this would have been great timing with an excuse to miss Beijing, for the Asian team this could only have been worse just before the tour, if they can finesse this to avoid TDU, but still win their home race and do something in Beijing they'll think it's been rather a good result

    Indeed and, if you ask me, that's exactly why nobody's talked to Iglinkskiy yet. The whole thing is about precisely managed delay, just to make sure that they can wiggle the dates to fit just right with whatever their plan already requires.

    Astana never really does anything before April anyway (ironically, Iglinskiy himself was always their early Spring mainstay) so a beginning-of-season ban would probably sit well, even if I could also understand the Blank-faced Blood Buster et al wanting to leave this one behind in 2014.
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  • Claudio Cappuccino

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    Re: The Iglinskiy Family- EPO Positives
    « Reply #44 on: October 04, 2014, 08:30 »
    I am confused, why does one need EPO when one can do this cleans:



    Cyclisme a deux vitesses, poor Vicenzo.

    I almost forgot, wasnt the explanation for this Maxim was taking his training more seriously?
    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/vinokourov-maxim-iglinskiy-won-liege-bastogne-liege-the-vino-way
    Quote
    Vinokourov revealed why Iglinskiy didn't win a big Classic until the age of 31. "He lacked motivation," the (substitute) member of the Kazakh Parliament said. "When he won the Strade Bianche and a stage of Tirreno-Adriatico in 2010, I told Maxim: ‘you can ride like Valverde' but he said: ‘no!!! I'm not at this level'. This year he's gone to altitude training camps here and there and he's motivated again. After this victory, he can step up to another level. He'll go back to Kazakhstan tomorrow and take some rest prior to training for the Tour de France and why not the Olympic Games."

    What is that saying again? When it walks like a duck...
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  • al_pacino

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #47 on: October 06, 2014, 08:28 »
    it's hard to disagree which those tweets. If you have a team skirting around rules basically designed to smarten up the image of your sport(Amonst a few other things) I wouldn't want to be associated with them.
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  • LukasCPH

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #48 on: October 06, 2014, 15:33 »
    I can see Wuori's point.
    Astana certainly aren't playing by the spirit of the rules in this case.

    But, in my opinion, the rules are good as they are.
    It shouldn't be after the first positive already (it is at least possible that a rider would go 'rogue' without team knowledge), so two positives before a self-suspension is right. And it is only fair that the cases have to be watertight, that's a basic principle of law - innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around.

    As long as there are rules in this world, there will always be someone who'll do anything to bend them as far as possible to his own advantage without explicitly breaking them. Sadly, that is human nature.
    You can't fault the MPCC for Astana's charade.

    Should Astana be suspended from MPCC? Maybe.
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  • lancasterke

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #49 on: October 06, 2014, 15:47 »
    i do get DW's point.

    if it was a wada rule i'd expect every one to play to the letter of the rules, but considering it's a voluntary rule designed to show transparency it makes a bit of a mockery if a team is preventing a confession to allow it to compete in one more race before it's ban.

    there are probably multiple teams who'd be happy to be banned for Bejing and no one who'd want to be banned for letour. getting to move your ban dramatically changes the severity of the ban itself, and as such should be unacceptable to the other mpcc members
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  • cj2002

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #51 on: October 06, 2014, 16:28 »
    4 years ban for Maxim to be announced soon I guess...
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  • cj2002

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #52 on: October 06, 2014, 16:29 »
    4 years ban for Maxim to be announced soon I guess...

    Almost certainly. The ball is now firmly in the MPCC's Court.
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  • Flo

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #53 on: October 06, 2014, 16:53 »
    They don't even wait a few days to make it seem less obvious :fp
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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #54 on: October 06, 2014, 17:01 »
    They don't even wait a few days to make it seem less obvious :fp

    you only have 7 (working) days time to request the analysis of a b-sample anyway, starting the day after the notification. I don't know what day Iglinskiy was notified, but probably before the start list for the World Championships was published (Friday last week), so I guess today was the last chance anyway
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  • Flo

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #55 on: October 06, 2014, 17:04 »
    you only have 7 (working) days time to request the analysis of a b-sample anyway, starting the day after the notification. I don't know what day Iglinskiy was notified, but probably before the start list for the World Championships was published (Friday last week), so I guess today was the last chance anyway

    :fp :fp Vino :fp Astana :fp MPCC :fp
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  • pastronef

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #56 on: October 06, 2014, 17:06 »
    Andrés Cánovas @andrescanovas  38m 
    MPCC. Me Parto el Culo, Colega.

    partirse el culo = LMAO
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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #57 on: October 06, 2014, 17:21 »
    I don't really get where all the criticism for MPCC comes from. How are they supposed to avoid a situation like this?

    The timing was "unlucky" of course, but as Fus said above, the rider is "innocent until proven guilty", so asking to suspend complete teams based on a positive a-sample is a hard call.

    It would not only need to be a-samples then, but also starting blood pass investigations for example - no matter if the riders turns out to be innocent or not. And imagine Sky/Tinkoff (not mpcc members, but anyway) to have to sit out the Tour de France or OPQS to sit out Paris-Roubaix for a rider to turn out to be not-positive in the end. Havoc would start...
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  • Havetts

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #58 on: October 06, 2014, 17:56 »
    MPCC needs to eject Astana, if it doesnt it eject Astana it proves and confirms the fact that MPCC is just the PR farce that it seems.
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  • Mellow Velo

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    Re: The Iglinskiys: EPO Positives
    « Reply #59 on: October 06, 2014, 18:01 »
    While this move is clearly self-serving, it will undoubtedly cause rumblings at the MPCC HQ and in the process does irreparable damage to the teams image, in terms both anti-doping and in Vino, having turned over a new leaf.

    Nibs and Aru need to get out of there, tout suite.
    (not that they will)
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