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Armchair Cyclist

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2015 Spring Classics CQ game
« on: February 02, 2015, 00:24 »
New header (The lower part of this message is the original post to start the discussion: the first part is the headline information)
Teams12 riders, to a budget of 3000 points from the 31 December 2014 download: this spreadsheet at Dropbox might help.
All riders available (except Valverde, who single handedly would put a team over budget), no distinct doper rules.

Scoring CQ points gained in following 20 one day races:
28/2  Omloop Het Nieuwsblad - 1.HC
28/2  Sud Ardeche - 1.1
1/3 Kuurne-Brussel-Kuurne - 1.1
1/3 Drome Classic - 1.1
1/3 GP di Lugano - 1.HC
4/3  Le Samyn - 1.1
7/3  Strade Bianche - 1.HC
18/3  Nokere Koerse - 1.1
22/3  Milano - Sanremo - 1.WT1
25/3  Dwars door Vlaanderen - 1.HC
26/3  Classica Corsica - 1.1
27/3  E3 Harelbeke - 1.WT2
29/3  Gent - Wevelgem - 1.WT2
5/4  Ronde van Vlaanderen - 1.WT1
8/4  Scheldeprijs - 1.HC
12/4  Paris - Roubaix - 1.WT1
15/4  Brabantse Pijl - 1.HC
19/4  Amstel Gold Race - 1.WT2
22/4  La Flèche Wallonne - 1.WT2
26/4  Liège - Bastogne - Liège - 1.WT1
Results will be taken as final after full results of LBL are published: subsequent alterations doe to disqualifications will not be considered part of the game.

Entering
PM to me either at CN or at Velorooms (the latter preferable if you are registered at both because of mailbox size limitations and handling of diacritics) by the beginning of the Omloop on Saturday 28 February (10:45 am GMT)
Please submit names in CQ format (easily cut and pasted from the dropbox spreadsheet above) with nothing else on each line.  Depending on what spare time I have when I open the message, I reserve the right to send teams back for the manager to format correctly.
Entrants as of 00:30 on Saturday 28th (UK time):
AG
Akuryo
Alykaptan
AmisVelo
ArchieBoy
Armchair
Asdfgh101
Batchuba
CaptCavman
Comodoro
Crevaison
Del1962
DJSprtsch
DJW
GeraintTooFast
GPBlanco
Hugo87
Jancouver
Joelsim
Josedin
JosephD
JustSomeGuy
Karaev
Kazistuta
LaVelocipede
Leadbelly
LightBing
LosBrolin
Madrazo
MellowVelo
Murali
Murrjt
NairoQ
Nepetalactone
Oliveira
PBlazer
RoteLaterne
Scrool07
Search
TomJelte
Trudgin
Vesica
*: Issue with selection, manager informed

What follows is the initial starter to the thread.
Tradition (if something that started 2 years ago can claim to have its own established traditions) has the Classics season competition as 12 riders and 3000 pts budget based on 31 December GQ download.

We normally have started from the Omloop, and finished with Liege-Bastogne-Liege.  The WT races have been unquestioned for inclusion, but which HC and 1.1 races have been included has always been a matter for debate.

To try to establish some principle into that debate, rather than a matter of like/dislike, I noted last year the number of WT teams that took part in each race that either was, or could potentially have been, included.  (WT races not included in this list, no need to argue over their inclusion, and by definition they had 18 WT teams taking part last year)

WT Teams/ Race/ observations
14   Scheldeprijs      1.HC, included 2013 and 14   
14   Dwars door Vlaanderen      1.HC, included 2013 and 14   
11   Kuurne - Brussel - Kuurne      Included 2013 and 14   
11   Strade Bianche      Included 2013 and 14   
11   Omloop Het Nieuwsblad      1.HC, included 2013 and 14   
9   GP Citta di Camaiore      Added in 2014   
9   Roma Maxima      Included 2013 and 14   
8   Classic Sud Ardèche         
8   Valence Drôme Classic         
8   Brabantse Pijl      1.HC, included 2013 and 14   
7   Nokere Koerse         
6   Le Samyn         
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

5   GP La Marseillaise      Before Omloop   
5   Handzame Classic         
5   GP de Denain         
4   GP di Lugano      Included 2013 and 14   
4   GP Nobili Rubinetterie         
4   Rund um den Finanzplatz Eschborn      1.HC  after Liege-B-L   
3   Trofeo Laigueglia      Before Omloop   
3   Classic Loire Atlantique         
3   GP Cholet - Pays De Loire         
3   Route Adélie de Vitré         
3   GP Miguel Indurain      Included 2013 and 14   
3   Paris - Camembert         
3   Tour du Finistère         
3   Tro-Bro Léon      Added in 2014   
3   La Roue Tourangelle         
3   GP de la Somme      1.HC  after Liege-B-L   
2   GP Costa degli Etruschi      Before Omloop   
2   Ronde van Drenthe         
2   Dwars door Drenthe         
2   Volta Limburg Classic         
2   Vuelta a La Rioja         
2   GP Pino Cerami         
1   Vuelta a Murcia      Added in 2014   
1   Clasica de Almeria         
1   Klasika Primavera      Included 2013 and 14   
1   Rund um Köln         


On the basis of this, I suggest that we drop 6 races on the grounds of a low participation rate (<1/3) by top teams, as indicated by the dotted line.  Thus we would lose Murcia, Almeria (which are both much earlier this year, 2 weeks before Omloop)  Indurain, Primavera, Tro-Bro Leon and Lugano (of which more to follow).  These races made up 27% of the events last year, but only 2.7 % of the occasions on which selected riders scored points.

In their place, by the criterion of WT participation, I suggest we add in Sud Ardeche, Drome, Nokere Koerse and Le Samyn.  I note that Lugano has been upgraded to 1.HC: if there is evidence that there will be at least 6 WT teams, then consistency would suggest that it could be reprieved.  I also see a new (or at least revived) race, Classica Corsica, on the calendar: is it likely to have an impressive field?

So I suggest that the programme should be:
28/2  Omloop Het Nieuwsblad - 1.HC
28/2  Sud Ardeche - 1.1
1/3 Kuurne-Brussel-Kuurne - 1.1
1/3 Drome Classic - 1.1
1/3 GP di Lugano - 1.HC  ????
4/3  Le Samyn - 1.1
5/3  G.P. Camaiore - 1.1
7/3  Strade Bianche - 1.HC (upgraded: hooray!!)
8/3   Roma Maxima - 1.1 (I see it on the calendar, but I thought I had read of its demise)
18/3  Nokere Koerse - 1.1
22/3  Milano - Sanremo - 1.WT1
25/3  Dwars door Vlaanderen - 1.HC
26/3  Classica Corsica - 1.1 ????
27/3  E3 Harelbeke - 1.WT2
29/3  Gent - Wevelgem - 1.WT2
5/4  Ronde van Vlaanderen - 1.WT1
8/4  Scheldeprijs - 1.HC
12/4  Paris - Roubaix - 1.WT1
15/4  Brabantse Pijl - 1.HC
19/4  Amstel Gold Race - 1.WT2
22/4  La Flèche Wallonne - 1.WT2
26/4  Liège - Bastogne - Liège - 1.WT1


Other than these changes to the programme, I would like to propose a change to the rider prices policy: rather than charge returning dopers at a pre-punishment CQ price, that they, like anyone else, be priced per their 2014 price.  Reasons: convenience to organiser, not our place to censor selection, not the only reason some riders are cheap.

Before I invite any submission of teams, any observations on the above, or info about Lugano/Corsica fields?



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  • « Last Edit: February 28, 2015, 00:39 by Armchair Cyclist »

    just some guy

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #1 on: February 02, 2015, 04:18 »
    Sounds good to me AC

    a true favourite game this one and yes Roma Maxima is not being run this year
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  • Of course, if this turns out someday to be the industry standard integrated handlebar-computer-braking solution then I'll eat my kevlar-reinforced aerodynamic hat.

    Larri Nov 12, 2014

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #2 on: February 02, 2015, 07:34 »
    Before I invite any submission of teams, any observations on the above, or info about Lugano/Corsica fields?

    The GP Lugano has been promoted to 1.HC this year and it's the 125th anniversary of the Veloclub Lugano, so they will try to line up a better field. No idea about Corsica, but as it takes place 2 days before the Criterium International I guess the participating teams and riders will be more or less the same?!
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  • "If this is cycling, I am a banana"

    just some guy

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #3 on: February 02, 2015, 10:23 »
    Hilly classics super hard to find value 1st look

    Post Merge: February 02, 2015, 10:46
    23 on a short list  for  team JSG :D
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  • « Last Edit: February 02, 2015, 10:47 by just some guy »

    Capt_Cavman

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #4 on: February 02, 2015, 11:49 »
    My favourite game! Possibly my only game come to think of it.

    Happy to accept whatever races you see fit. My only quibble would be about pricing of returning dopers; rather than fill every team with returning offenders, wouldn't it be easier on the conscience to exclude them from the game completely until they had completed a full year?
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  • Blackbandit222

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #5 on: February 02, 2015, 19:10 »
    IT'S CYCLING SEASON !!!  Cobbled Classics rule!  I'll take Sagan, Kristoff & Deglenkolb please.  :party
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  • Sagan supporter.

    Trudgin

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #6 on: February 02, 2015, 23:25 »
    Sounds good to me AC

    a true favourite game this one and yes Roma Maxima is not being run this year

    Really, no Roma Maxima??
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  • I love Italian cycling, well cyclists & the odd Spaniard, oh & that 1 particular Slovakian  then there are those with names  that are great fun - zzzdnek steeeebar & Tieeeeeeeesj Benoooot

    Trudgin

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #7 on: February 02, 2015, 23:37 »
    Right guys...

    12 riders 3000points

    Is there a secret pool of classics specialists in CQRankings or am i supposed to dive into my superior pool of  knowledge and pick from the general CQ bunch?
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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #8 on: February 02, 2015, 23:41 »
    I might still have some useful looking lists somewhere, which turned out to be totally useless in the end so far
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  • Armchair Cyclist

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #9 on: February 03, 2015, 00:33 »

    Is there a secret pool of classics specialists in CQRankings or am i supposed to dive into my superior pool of  knowledge and pick from the general CQ bunch?

    The end of game spreadsheet from last year (on Dropbox), and particularly the Results Classics tab shows how the relevant races (or at least the ones relevant last year) distributed their points.
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  • Trudgin

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #10 on: February 03, 2015, 09:41 »
    Thanks guys..
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  • DJW

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #11 on: February 03, 2015, 20:54 »
    Brilliant, can't wait!
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  • Leadbelly

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #12 on: February 03, 2015, 21:35 »
    GP Camaiore won't be run this year either.
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  • just some guy

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #13 on: February 10, 2015, 11:28 »
    AC do we have some final dates etc as I have had a few questions on twitter
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  • Armchair Cyclist

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #14 on: February 10, 2015, 16:05 »
    Thanks for the prompt.

    So this is the official launch: the races are:

    28/2  Omloop Het Nieuwsblad - 1.HC
    28/2  Sud Ardeche - 1.1
    1/3 Kuurne-Brussel-Kuurne - 1.1
    1/3 Drome Classic - 1.1
    1/3 GP di Lugano - 1.HC 
    4/3  Le Samyn - 1.1
    7/3  Strade Bianche - 1.HC
    18/3  Nokere Koerse - 1.1
    22/3  Milano - Sanremo - 1.WT1
    25/3  Dwars door Vlaanderen - 1.HC
    26/3  Classica Corsica - 1.1
    27/3  E3 Harelbeke - 1.WT2
    29/3  Gent - Wevelgem - 1.WT2
    5/4  Ronde van Vlaanderen - 1.WT1
    8/4  Scheldeprijs - 1.HC
    12/4  Paris - Roubaix - 1.WT1
    15/4  Brabantse Pijl - 1.HC
    19/4  Amstel Gold Race - 1.WT2
    22/4  La Flèche Wallonne - 1.WT2
    26/4  Liège - Bastogne - Liège - 1.WT1

    I have included Lugano and Corsica, not on the grounds of them having earned it last year , but because there is reason to believe that Lugano might have a better field this year, and because if most teams that ride the Criterium International take part in the "clasica", that would meet the 1/3 WT teams expectation.  And because we have lost the Roma Maxima and Camaiore.  The vast bulk of the points will be from higher ranked races anyway.



    So: 17 days and 8 hours to go, 12 riders, 3000 point budget on 31/12/2014 prices (for all riders, suspensions during 2014 notwithstanding)

    Good luck all
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  • Trudgin

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #15 on: February 11, 2015, 00:45 »
    Right team in... I have been ruthless...

    At least i think its in, Armchair Cyclist??
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  • DJW

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #16 on: February 13, 2015, 13:31 »
    Shortlist down to 13 riders...
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  • just some guy

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #17 on: February 13, 2015, 13:34 »
    Shortlist down to 13 riders...

    Nice I am really finding the Hilly classics hard tbh
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  • DJW

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #18 on: February 13, 2015, 14:02 »
    Same, going to involve a couple of long shots I think
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  • just some guy

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #19 on: February 16, 2015, 12:32 »
    Think I got my team done, thanks for the reminder search



     3 *au ,  3 *it , 2 *no , 2 *be , 1 *gb , 1 *fr

    at this stage
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  • « Last Edit: February 16, 2015, 12:44 by just some guy »

    batchuba

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #20 on: February 16, 2015, 18:54 »
    Yay, I love this thing.

    Team is ready to submit; just waiting to see if they all still have intact collarbones on the 28th.
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  • Joelsim

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #21 on: February 16, 2015, 19:00 »
    Mine is done too.

    I have 12 riders in my team  :shh


    5 *be
    2 *it
    2 *ch
    1 *gb
    1 *no
    1 *nl
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  • « Last Edit: February 16, 2015, 19:13 by Joelsim »

    DJW

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #22 on: February 16, 2015, 20:31 »
    Seem to have more of an international feel to mine...

    *be
    *it
    *au
    *gb
    *cz
    *no
    *co
    *si
    *lu
    *fr
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  • Trudgin

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #23 on: February 16, 2015, 23:05 »

    1 French
    1 Dutch
    1 Czech
    3 Belgian
     :o :o :o :o
    6 Italians  :shh
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  • just some guy

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #24 on: February 17, 2015, 07:20 »
    AC can we please get a list of teams sent in that are all OK
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  • just some guy

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #25 on: February 17, 2015, 10:17 »
    Rumor has it AG has a team together  :shh
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  • Capt_Cavman

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #26 on: February 17, 2015, 10:31 »
    Last year I used a two-pronged approach, rigourous statistical analysis combined with personal knowledge and intuition. I think I crept into the top ten using this method so not too bad but... Of the four riders that were selected purely on the basis of my encyclopaedic knowledge of the sport and ability to spot unrealised talent, I netted a grand total of 10 points from an outlay of over 700.

    So this year it's hard science all the way.
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  • AG

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #27 on: February 17, 2015, 10:33 »
    yep

    a scientific approach from me too  :lol
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  • Armchair Cyclist

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #28 on: February 21, 2015, 00:06 »
    A week and a day to go, 10 teams in so far:
    AG
    Akuryo
    Armchair
    Comodoro
    DJW
    Joelsim
    JustSomeGuy
    RoteLaterne
    Scrool07
    Trudgin

    Already 67 riders nominated: 5 in at least half the teams, 43 unique picks.
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  • Armchair Cyclist

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    Re: 2015 Spring Classics CQ game
    « Reply #29 on: February 22, 2015, 01:56 »

    2015 Classics CQ Game selector spreadsheet at Dropbox.

    Hopefully this will reduce the proportion of team submissions that are either overbudget or have names that need reformatting.
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