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LukasCPH

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Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
« Reply #30 on: April 05, 2017, 19:50 »
Peter Sagan moves teams to Bora Hansgrohe this year - and has handpicked half his team.  So why, oh why has he picked such a poor one? :fp 
Maybe he should have settled for a lower wage for himself so that they could have attracted stronger support?
On the other hand, which other riders would have been available this off-season?

And if he wins on Sunday - which is not at all out of question -, this whole discussion will be forgotten. :)
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  • 2017 0711|CYCLING PR Manager; 2016 Stölting Content Editor
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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #31 on: April 05, 2017, 19:57 »
    And if he wins on Sunday - which is not at all out of question -, this whole discussion will be forgotten. :)

    yep, and to be fair, Burghardt and Saramotins (on paper at least) are excellent support for Roubaix.
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  • "If this is cycling, I am a banana"

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #32 on: April 06, 2017, 08:59 »
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  • Of course, if this turns out someday to be the industry standard integrated handlebar-computer-braking solution then I'll eat my kevlar-reinforced aerodynamic hat.

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #33 on: April 06, 2017, 10:31 »
    Phinney also out for #cannondale

    Will Clarke gets a ride though one of his life in cycling goals was ride Roubaix so that is cool and a probable break member
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  • just some guy

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #34 on: April 06, 2017, 10:43 »
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  • AG

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #35 on: April 06, 2017, 10:52 »
    Phinney also out for #cannondale

    Will Clarke gets a ride though one of his life in cycling goals was ride Roubaix so that is cool and a probable break member

    wow - heavy cost from RvV for Cannondale.   

    Still - with the form VanBaarle is in, they might end up happy enough
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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #37 on: April 06, 2017, 13:21 »

    Maybe he should have settled for a lower wage for himself so that they could have attracted stronger support?
    On the other hand, which other riders would have been available this off-season?




    ... spent more on their "Cooking Revolution" TV ad   :shh
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  • hiero

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #38 on: April 06, 2017, 15:14 »
    . . .

    Whether he is strong enough mentally to cope with the weight of expectations is another matter totally.

    He IS showing his irritation a little more each year, it seems. Maybe I'm just noticing more.

    AG, your favs analysis is great. Just one problem with it - I think this year is going to be one for the unknowns again. Unless they can make some kind of early selection to a small group of strong men - like RvV - everybody big is going to be too busy watching the others.

    I'd love to see Boonen win it - just as a farewell salute. But I don't think he's going to, much as it pains me to say. Nor do I think Sagan will take it - everybody really IS riding against him, time and time again. It seems to me even worse than riders not working with Canc in his day.
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    LukasCPH

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #40 on: April 06, 2017, 21:02 »
    He IS showing his irritation a little more each year, it seems. Maybe I'm just noticing more.

    AG, your favs analysis is great. Just one problem with it - I think this year is going to be one for the unknowns again. Unless they can make some kind of early selection to a small group of strong men - like RvV - everybody big is going to be too busy watching the others.

    I'd love to see Boonen win it - just as a farewell salute. But I don't think he's going to, much as it pains me to say. Nor do I think Sagan will take it - everybody really IS riding against him, time and time again. It seems to me even worse than riders not working with Canc in his day.
    I agree.

    Not expecting one of the big favourites to win. It could be Trentin "doing a Knaven" ... or Kristoff (who I don't see as that big of a favourite this year for some reason). Stuyven is a dark horse as well.
    Who knows.

    What I'm sure of is that it will be a great race. :cool
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  • AG

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #41 on: April 07, 2017, 00:23 »
    He IS showing his irritation a little more each year, it seems. Maybe I'm just noticing more.

    AG, your favs analysis is great. Just one problem with it - I think this year is going to be one for the unknowns again. Unless they can make some kind of early selection to a small group of strong men - like RvV - everybody big is going to be too busy watching the others.

    I'd love to see Boonen win it - just as a farewell salute. But I don't think he's going to, much as it pains me to say. Nor do I think Sagan will take it - everybody really IS riding against him, time and time again. It seems to me even worse than riders not working with Canc in his day.

    I do agree - I actually think that with everyone riding against Sagan it will be a lottery as to who manages to pull it off. 

    I think Quickstep will keep pushing guys up the road hoping that the chase will be disjointed - and IMO there is a pretty good chance that eventually a small group staying away.  Which move will work?   that is the big gamble .....
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  • Echoes

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #42 on: April 07, 2017, 07:55 »
    Want Tommeke to win if only for De Vlaeminck's reaction.  :P

    He wouldn't say anything special. He doesn't really care about it, has said it several times. Anyway that won't happen.  :P
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  • "Paris-Roubaix is the biggest cycling race in the world, bigger than the Tour de France, bigger than any other bike race" (Sir Bradley Wiggins)

    Flo

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #43 on: April 07, 2017, 22:02 »
    Scarred for life. Open at your own risk. Can't look at Tommeke the same way again :o
    Spoiler (hover to show)
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    Joelsim

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #44 on: April 08, 2017, 10:47 »
    Scarred for life. Open at your own risk. Can't look at Tommeke the same way again :o
    Spoiler (hover to show)

    Cheesy beans.
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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #45 on: April 08, 2017, 10:51 »
    I agree.

    Not expecting one of the big favourites to win. It could be Trentin "doing a Knaven" ... or Kristoff (who I don't see as that big of a favourite this year for some reason). Stuyven is a dark horse as well.
    Who knows.

    What I'm sure of is that it will be a great race. :cool

    In theory this should be the ideal race for Kristoff. Even if he's not in top shape he manages to win the sprint for 4th or 5th as seen in MSR and Flanders, in long, hard, races. He certainly gives it everything he's got. In previous years he's been unlucky. Dege is similar.

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  • t-72

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #46 on: April 08, 2017, 13:06 »
    In theory this should be the ideal race for Kristoff. Even if he's not in top shape he manages to win the sprint for 4th or 5th as seen in MSR and Flanders, in long, hard, races. He certainly gives it everything he's got. In previous years he's been unlucky. Dege is similar.

    Kristoff has never had a good feeling about the P-R, but this year he has made some changes in preparations for the classics season which looks like pointing towards a prioritization of P-R relative to RVV: a later form curve peak and less focus on explosive hill climbs. However, I don't think Kristoff is good on the cobbles :)
    That's of course an exageration as there are about 50 on this planet that can follow him, but, I mean - the cobblestones in RVV is a different breed (mostly of the good looking garden variety) compared to the long rustic cobble sections in P-R. So far in his career there is no doubt that Kristoff better matches the Vlaanderen cobbles than the P-R ones. Kristoff can endure the flat cobble sections, but he does not excel at them. The cobbles are not his competitive advantage.

    Further to that, he rides his regular bike with fatter tires and he missed out on the #katusha Katusha team cobbles section recon ride yesterday due to a delayed flight. OK, he has previously (2015) commented that the recon ride never gave him much in terms of increased performance on race day. This hints to one of his weaknesses on varied terrain, he doesn't seem to be able to memorize the course and visualize it to guide his placement on the cobbles, he picks his route on visual impression as he rides. (Could learn something from #joker Markus Hoelgaard and #tss Andreas Vangstad or why not *no Kjetil Jansrud there...)

    In other words, I don't think Kristoff is as much as a favorite as some thinks he is - but he can still win it. A more technical rider who can go faster over the cobbles can likely distance him on the Carrefour de l'Arbre or maybe as early as in the Auchy-lez-Orchies à Bersée/Mons-en-Pévèle area: from ~55km to ~45 km from the finish there are 6 km of cobbles grade 4 and grade 5 - that's got to hurt! This is technically the hardest part after the Arenberg, but much longer. Perhaps it does not get enough attention in the previews, but the tendency in this year's cobbled classics of winning moves from a looong way out suggest this will be the critical part of the race. 
    My prediction now is Sagan, Boonen and dark horse EBH cut clear from here.. :shh
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  • « Last Edit: April 08, 2017, 13:22 by t-72 »

    Not My Circus

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #47 on: April 08, 2017, 13:39 »
    Thought I'd add this to the L'Enfer Du Nord video must watch list...

    De achterkant van 'de Hel' (The back of 'Hell') from Dutch broadcaster NOS in 2013

    It makes me shiver for the haunting music, for the broom wagon, for the weary & battered, for the thousand yard stares, for Jerome Cousin being more French than a Gauloise, and for Chris Juul Jensen's "I'm f*5#ed man".



    CJJ was the last man to make the velodrome some 26 mins behind the winner Fabian Cancellara.
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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #48 on: April 08, 2017, 16:56 »
    *be Het Nieuwsblad

    :*:*:*:*:* Boonen
    :*:*:*:* Terpstra, Degenkolb
    :*:*:* Sagan, Naesen, GvA
    :*:* Stannard, Démare, Durbridge, Hayman
    :* EBH, Lampaert, Greipel, Kristoff, Stuyven
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  • pastronef

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #50 on: April 09, 2017, 09:27 »
    more star ratings:

    *fr l'Équipe
    :*:*:*:*:* Boonen, Sagan
    :*:*:*:* GvA, Degenkolb
    :*:*:* Kristoff, Stybar, Terpstra
    :*:* Greipel, Naesen, Stannard
    :* EBH, Démare, Durbridge, Stuyven


    *it Gazzetta dello Sport
    :*:*:*:*:* Boonen
    :*:*:*:* Sagan, Degenkolb
    :*:*:* Stannard, Kristoff
    :*:* GvA
    :* Terpstra, Hayman
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  • Echoes

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #51 on: April 09, 2017, 20:28 »
    We may give comments by now, can't we?

    I'm just over the moon right now. Finally Greg wins a major classic after winning Paris-Tours and Ghent-Wevelgem and not any other classics, the greatest of them all and the one he least expected to win. It's just unbelievable. He deserves it more than anyone else for his competitiveness, his ability to endure pain (I still cannot believe he's done all his career despite the Haglund syndrome!), his fighting spirit and aggressive racing. He's on top of the world now. It cannot get higher than this. Everything that now comes is bonus.

    Pretty sure that Sagan supporters will once again point to his bad luck but you only need to look at how he finished and crossed the Carrefour de l'Arbre to understand that the De Vlaeminck theory "puncture are no bad luck but a matter of clear-mindedness" applies to him. How far did he end? When you think that Naesen had even more bad luck and even Van Avermaet had bad luck at the worst possible moment. You cannot invoke that for Sagan.

    Greg said he could not understand Styby's tactics. Neither can I. I mean behind was Boonen but also Degekolb and eventually also sprinters like Greipel or Démare came back. Styby had equal chance to beat Van Avermaet than Boonen to outsprint all these guys. I guess Quick Step wished Boonen to say farewell in style  but in the end he just say farewell in classless mood accusing Degenkolb of racing "the most pathetic race of his life". Right or wrong it's sad to end a career with such words. I don't blame Styby because knowing Lefevere it definitely was team orders. 

    Also I'm very glad with Piet Allegaert's 18th. You remember my post last year when he raced the Tour of Alberta last year as a trainee for Trek:          http://velorooms.com/index.php?topic=8166.30


    Oh and now glad to see that De Vlaeminck's record has survived the Boonen/Cancellara generation. Equalled but not broken.  :D
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  • Leadbelly

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #52 on: April 09, 2017, 20:34 »
    https://twitter.com/quintencouckuyt/status/851131319694307328

    .....and arrested by the cops according to some other tweets. :D
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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #53 on: April 09, 2017, 20:35 »
    yeah, a good race again, as usual. I don't think van Avermaet really was the strongest today, but he raced cleverly, attacked at the right time, and that's a major part of it as well. Personally I was a bit sad to see Oss having to sacrifice his own chances - but well, it paid off in the end.

    I'm happy for Langeveld by the way - sure, Stuyven & Moscon did a great race as well, but it would have been sad if he had lost the podium due to Greg & Stybar playing games.
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  • t-72

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #54 on: April 09, 2017, 22:27 »

    Also I'm very glad with Piet Allegaert's 18th. You remember my post last year when he raced the Tour of Alberta last year as a trainee for Trek:          http://velorooms.com/index.php?topic=8166.30


    I admit I had forgotten everything I possibly knew about him and thought there was some kind of mistake in the results list! I was like WTF? who's that? - but yes, a very good result indeed reminds me of Tiesj Benoot ... was that 2 years ago?
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  • AG

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #55 on: April 10, 2017, 00:43 »
    it was a pretty good race - without being spectacular for any one thing.

    Racing was on hard and early as no break ... so it was always going to be a struggle to the end.

    Considering the long chase back on after a crash, GVA did well to be back up there - though for his chase he had teammates so that made a big difference.

    I thought Oss was fantastic - and the decision to make Oss sit up was I thought an interesting one.  I thought Oss had a pretty good chance of making it if GVA didnt chase behind, and none of the others wanted to either ... but obviously BMC was as all in for Greg as Quickstep was for Tommeke

    Bit sad for Tom that he was so strong, but not quite strong enough.  He wasnt quite up to it when it counted - when Greg bridged to Stybar, Tom should have been able to stick to his wheel ... but couldnt.

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #56 on: April 10, 2017, 09:49 »
    Greg said he could not understand Styby's tactics. Neither can I. I mean behind was Boonen but also Degekolb and eventually also sprinters like Greipel or Démare came back. Styby had equal chance to beat Van Avermaet than Boonen to outsprint all these guys.

    I think playing the 'Boonen excuse' was alright. Stybar was 2nd already, and to be able to really have a chance to beat van Avermaet he needed to save some energy. Langeveld and Greg were always going to work anyway
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  • t-72

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #57 on: April 10, 2017, 10:50 »
    One thing I question: What did the intense start of the race, with no attacks really sticking until 90 km do to the way the race unfolded later? Did anyone notice something out-of-the-ordinary swing of things in P-R? :slow
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  • Mellow Velo

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #58 on: April 10, 2017, 11:14 »
    The mystery of the disappearing Terpstra is solved.....

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  • "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.

    AG

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    Re: Paris-Roubaix l'enfer du Nord
    « Reply #59 on: April 10, 2017, 11:18 »
    I do think the intense start had a major impact on the race.

    The big hitters - GVA, Sagan, Boonen etc - they needed a super hard race in order to win.  Otherwise the cooperation between them was possibly going to crumble (as it did with the Boonen/Sagan group at hte end) which might have given a move more of a chance off the front.

    I admit to being a little surprised that Degenkolb wasnt a bit stronger - he seemed to be feeling pretty good until those last few cobbled sections when he couldnt bridge to the Stybar group along with GVA and Sagan
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