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Topic Summary

Posted by: Fus87
« on: April 14, 2013, 20:52 »

I agree with every word of that.
Posted by: Caruut
« on: April 14, 2013, 20:24 »

I don't own a TV. I'm a student, I don't have a living room, I just have a laptop. I can't realistically buy a subscription for my family home, I only live there for a few months in the summer (when the big cycling event is on free-to-air TV in the UK).

Without Livestreams I just wouldn't have the same interest in cycling that I do now. All the sponsors who pay good money to keep the sport afloat would be losing out on exposure to me and people like me. I don't want to use steams. When I'm at my family home and the Tour is on TV I don't get up some crappy website that looks like it's going to give me malware and watch a pixellated feed that keeps cutting out.

What I'm essentially getting at is that people who feel like they have a choice in the matter wouldn't chose to use livestreams. People using them are doing so because they can't afford the paid service, don't have coverage of a particular race or otherwise don't suit the broadcast execs idea of what their viewer is. As with many media companies, the music industry especially, this perception is about 2 decades out of date. If broadcasters work at presenting viewing options that actually suit most fans then they wouldn't be in this predicament.

Typical short-sighted small-mindedness shown by so many companies. The problem is that the service being provided is inadequate for a lot of users, not that those users are somehow "criminals". They have to fix this at their end - the supply end - and not the demand end.

If I could get reliable HD streams of races I would happily pay for them. I love cycling, and hate behaving in a manner that I feel is morally grey. I do it, however, because I don't think that I'm presented with reasonable choices.
Posted by: Dim
« on: April 12, 2013, 23:49 »

http://www.youtube.com/user/RandomSportVideos?feature=watch

The guys a dick, just didnt use his common sense.. For years those of us who upload got largely ignored by keeping the uploads short, not claiming the revenue on them, and staying under the radar. One user being stupid and then attracting attention to everyone has caused all sorts of sh*t.
Posted by: Blackbandit222
« on: April 12, 2013, 23:30 »

What's his youtube user name?
Posted by: Dim
« on: April 12, 2013, 22:45 »

This one is all blowing up again, and not for the better.

Firstly, i fully believe that if people have channels in their country that are showing cycling, as a cycling fan they should rely on those channels, if they are true cycling fans and support the sport. However, I also believe there is a market for fans to be able to watch small parts of races they wouldnt other wise be able to see, after the race has completed via short unrestricted highlights.

Following Danny Nelissens emails last years things settled down a bit. Sporza broadcast most of the races not available worldwide or outside belgium unrestricted, and claims on highlights or closing km's footage slowed down. Uploaders started being sensible about what they did, only put up the final few km's, dont put up entire highlights packages, and dont put them up immediately after the race and plug the hell out  of them.

It was an unwritten agreement between the media and uploaders, but on the whole, it was tolerated as long as it was sensible.

That was until this February when a new youtube user appeared and started uploading videos, not just stage finishes, but entire 2 hour broadcasts taken from Eurosport. The minute I saw this my head was in my hands, one dickhead is all it takes to truly flip it up for everyone, and it looks like doing just that.

Not only was the user uploading full broadcasts, with the full race names, and then promoting them like crazy on social media, he was also allowing revenue sharing on his videos (to explain, you tube puts ads on videos and youtube gets the revenue, but if you get over a certain amount of views you can sign to get a share of this revenue from youtube - as long as its original content). Suffice it to say none of the other uploaders have ever allowed revenue sharing and have never profited from their videos.. This user chose to do so.

As a result, already several youtube accounts have been closed down, and the channel of random sports videos or @cycling_videos on twitter is also about to be closed down.

What makes it worse is hes not content to go down alone, and in a display of childish smallmindedness is drawing attention to the other uploaders who put content on video sites, including informing VRT and TF1 (Sporza and Eurosport) where to find other channels.

One small minded, greedy :censored, has undone all the work people did over the last few years in flying under the radar and not taking the pee, and is danger of screwing it up for everyone.

Nelissen has a point, livestreams and youtube footage can damage cycling, although it kinda peees me off to see Nelissens testimonial on procyclinglive, or the fact that certainly for some time Cyclingfans had agreements with at least a couple of World Tour teams to promote them. (I cant say wether this was financial or just trust based agreements), but livestreams of races to countries that cant recieve them can do a lot for the sport, as can limited, short highlights or footage from races, encourage people to support the race or even buy subscriptions.

The UCI and race organisers need to sort it out, some inroads are being made with the UCI channel, but its not enough. In the meantime, short highlights are the only accessible cycling for many people.

Sadly, one ignorant user, may have just fliped that up for everyone.
Posted by: ram
« on: May 02, 2012, 09:24 »

Aye, that's the issue with TV rights (and it's not just Bruyneel), and that's what I meant by saying that it won't be helpful for smaller teams. How much telly money is there in all other races apart from the GTs, monuments and major races like PN? Can't imagine there being all that much, certainly don't think it can sustain teams.

As for the jerseys and sponsors, I've grown up watching a sport in whites, it's a personal preference. I don't expect anyone to endorse my views, but certainly seeing an Androni or Landouwkrediet like classifieds column isn't to my taste.
Posted by: benotti69
« on: May 02, 2012, 09:18 »

It was happening, when this will spread to other organisers and telly companies is the more pertinent question. it is good for the larger and more visible teams in the more important races, possibly making them more stable and even avoiding HTC like situations (if telly money becomes the major income source over time). It may not be so positive for smaller teams looking to make their way up to the higher echelons. TV money is the most stable income stream in sport and will definitely help the teams, but as in the case of the Spanish footlball league, if it is done injudiciously, it can kill off all competition. Definitely a step out of the stone age though.

My biggest wish- that cycling strips stop being billboards.

Well RCS can afford it. What about the smaller races that cant? Will we have fúckers like Bruyneel demanding money to ride in their races or else? I think it should be part of the GTs and monuments but not necessarily all races or better still, based on what the race sells in advertising on the TV, teams get a % of that.

We forget that TV can charge big money for advertising during sporting events. That is why football is worth so much nowadays. But dont forget that RAI broadcast il Giro for 3 hours a day free. Most Football on TV is pay per view? Does cycling command such big money from advertising? I'm not sure and it is all based on how many watch?

Cycling as a sport really does try hard to prostitute itself to the sponsors and the jerseys are testamount to that. But small pro continental teams need every penny they can get so the name has to appear somewhere to justify the money?

Where should sponsors names go if not on the jersey? take a team like Landbouwkrediet-Euphony they have at least 9 sponsors names on the front! Farnese Vini - Selle Italia at least 8. A WT team like OPQS have 5. 



Posted by: ram
« on: May 02, 2012, 03:52 »

It was happening, when this will spread to other organisers and telly companies is the more pertinent question. it is good for the larger and more visible teams in the more important races, possibly making them more stable and even avoiding HTC like situations (if telly money becomes the major income source over time). It may not be so positive for smaller teams looking to make their way up to the higher echelons. TV money is the most stable income stream in sport and will definitely help the teams, but as in the case of the Spanish footlball league, if it is done injudiciously, it can kill off all competition. Definitely a step out of the stone age though.

My biggest wish- that cycling strips stop being billboards.
Posted by: AG
« on: May 02, 2012, 01:51 »

Its the way to move forward   :)
Posted by: Jamsque
« on: May 02, 2012, 00:46 »

I wasn't expecting to see this kind of deal so soon, but I love it.
Posted by: Dim
« on: May 02, 2012, 00:44 »

RCS Close to media partnership

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/rcs-sport-and-major-teams-on-cusp-of-tv-revenue-partnership

So RCS close to the expected tv deal that will see them share revenue with the teams. Which of course will bring the best teams to their races, which in turn means that the question will be asked, do the RCS really need the world tour.. Would you send your best team to the late season italian classics in return for tv revenue.. or to Beijing ;)
Posted by: benotti69
« on: April 01, 2012, 09:57 »

In spite of my last very bad experience with cycling.tv I signed up again tonight so that could watch what is left of the classics.

What they don't tell you - before you sign up is that they use Flash, for everything.

I use an iPad and beam it to my big screen TV.  So how well does cycling.tv work for me?

It dosen't.  And if these nitwits have their way I won't even be able to find feeds in languages I don't understand.

I may as well just start watching darts. That I can get on TV here.  Cycling, nope.

Can you not get the streams on sports-livez.com or sportslemon.tv ?

Sometimes the reception is not great but a lot better than watching nothing or having to rely on the cycling media race reports.
Posted by: Icebreaker
« on: April 01, 2012, 05:24 »

In spite of my last very bad experience with cycling.tv I signed up again tonight so that could watch what is left of the classics.

What they don't tell you - before you sign up is that they use Flash, for everything.

I use an iPad and beam it to my big screen TV.  So how well does cycling.tv work for me?

It dosen't.  And if these nitwits have their way I won't even be able to find feeds in languages I don't understand.

I may as well just start watching darts. That I can get on TV here.  Cycling, nope.
Posted by: Auscyclefan
« on: March 23, 2012, 22:39 »

Dauphine Libere will be televised on SBS this year for Australians. :)
Posted by: Jamsque
« on: March 07, 2012, 09:27 »

It's the same story we've been hearing from the music and film industry for the past decade.

Broadcasters are failing to adapt to the changing media landscape and they are hurling accusations instead of working to improve their own business model.
Posted by: Dim
« on: March 06, 2012, 16:30 »

 ;)
Posted by: lucky
« on: February 25, 2012, 23:32 »

If a global legal streaming subscription thing never comes to pass, and it doesn't seem that likely at the moment, maybe a site could be set up similar to LiveOnlineFooty. I don't know if anyone is familiar with it but it's an 'exclusive' site that opens registration now and then (payment of 36 for 60 days) and has secure streams of British football and some boxing for all registered members. Streams don't get taken down because it can't be linked/viewed outside of the members so they're secure.
Posted by: flicker2.0
« on: February 25, 2012, 05:40 »

In the US live streaming is pretty much all we have as fans.
Myself I do not have time, motivation, nor money to go to watch some guys zip past.
Big Lance supporter because he brought mainstream interest into cycling.
To bad, without TV or computer pro cycling fans will remain the underground fanbase.
I have a hard time understanding Kellys brough anyhow, much prefer the Aussie commentators, Phil and Paul Italian and Flemish, Waloons or French anyway before Kelly.
Posted by: pedaling squares
« on: February 25, 2012, 04:35 »

This kind of thinking will keep cycling from becoming a mainstream sport. Teams, organizations, sponsors, and broadcasters need to embrace the new forms of media and take advantage of the opportunities to sell their products. Using myself as a single example - I started watching live streams of the spring classics in 2010 and said, "Damn, I've got to be there." In 2011, I saw two classics in person and contributed to the local economy in the towns and businesses surrounding the events. Maybe Sporza didn't benefit directly from my presence, but surely my small contribution to the income generated by these events helps reinforce Sporza's decision to invest in cycling. And if I lived closer, would I watch the live feed on an unauthorized website in lieu of visiting the event or watching it on television? No chance, I'd be there in person if I could and I'd choose my big screen TV with proper audio system to a computer or mobile. But I don't have that choice. I watch live feeds of TV stations that don't broadcast in Canada and it's so much nicer than reading the recap on the cycling sites hours later. If I didn't have the chance to watch the events throughout the year, I doubt that I'd be invested in the sport to the point of trying to take the family to Quebec this fall. Again, Sporza doesn't benefit. But cycling does, and that cannot be harmful.
Posted by: just some guy
« on: February 20, 2012, 19:48 »

no, but they could ask why some world tour teams recieve payment in return for promoting sites giving links to "illegal" livestreams. I wouldnt want them to do that, good on teams for trying to help their fans out with coverage, but it shows the complete hypocrasy.

Globalisation but only if the UCI win.

How can the sport grow if there is less available to watch 

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